Remembered Today:

corisande

Capt J Boyle - 55th Coke's Rifles and 110th Mahratta L I

25 posts in this topic

I confess I am lost with Indian Army commissions. I have been trying to research a man who joined the ADRIC (Irish Auxiliary Police) in 1921, but apart from Indian Army all I have is "J Boyle"

My research so far - click link for MIC and notes - has got his MIC and a few LG entries. The MIC does not give his Christian name, nor any previous service

1917 Aug 30. Lands in France

1918 Jan 12. 1st Bn., 55th Coke's Rifles. Lieut. J. Boyle, I.A.R.O., attd., to be actg. Capt. while comdg. a Coy. From 12th to 30th Jan. 1918

1919 Jul 3. Indian Army Reserve of Officers. Lieutenants to be Captains. J. Boyle.

1921 Feb 16 Joined ADRIC with service no 1687. posted Platoon Commander in J Coy and A/CQM

His MIC mentions 110 Mahratta L I as well.

I cannot find his commission, mainly as I do not know his Christian name. I suspect that he was commissioned from the ranks - the single initial.

Can anyone who knows about Indian Army get me any further?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"Suitable Civilian Gentlemen" were inducted into the IARO and then commissioned into regiments and corps.

Another source of officers was the commissioning from the ranks of Indian Volunteer units, particularly those that had volunteered for overseas service in theatres such as East Africa, Mesopotamia, Egypt and France.

Harry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Perhaps his forename is on the medal rolls.

Regards,

Alf McM

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The following reference may be of help if you are able to get to the British Library in London

There is a book available at the British Library, in five volumes,

Alphabetical list giving particulars of officers of the Indian Army Reserve of Officers / [issued by] Army Headquarters, India, Military Secretary’s Branch. The catalogue entry states "Contents: [v.1]. 26th June 1916 _ v.2. 24th January 1917 _ v.3. 31st December 1917 _ v.4. 30th June 1918 _ v.5. 31st December 1918". The shelfmark is OIR 355.37 Open Access

This reference is taken from the FIBIS Fibiwiki page Indian Army, section Reserve of Officers

http://wiki.fibis.or...rve_of_Officers

Cheers

Maureen

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the hints, I live in Spain, so only visit UK rarely. I will have see if someone comes to the thread with anything concrete.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Going back over this chap, I never really found out much more except

 

Christian name "John"

 

Date of Birth 1894 Sep 10. Born Lanarkshire

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ID: 7   Posted (edited)

There are now a number of Indian Army Lists online.

 

From the July 1918 edition, on page  522 he is shown as 2nd Lieutenant, attached 1st Battalon, 55th Coke’s Rifles.

https://archive.org/stream/in.ernet.dli.2015.285012/2015.285012.Indian-Army#page/n845/mode/1up

 Edit: Copy and paste this link

I could not see him in the list of 2nd Lieutenants IARO from page 206d, but may have missed him. The book Search was not working.

https://archive.org/stream/in.ernet.dli.2015.285012/2015.285012.Indian-Army#page/n335/mode/1up/  

 Edit:Copy and paste this link

More online editions are linked on the FIBIS Fibiwiki page Indian Army List online.  Select the Archive.org versions

https://wiki.fibis.org/w/Indian_Army_List_online

 

Cheers

Maureen

Edited by Maureene

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Maureene

 

I will check those out.

 

Never eases to amaze me how much is added to on-line searches each year

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In the January 1919 Indian Army List he is in the 1st Battalion, 55th Coke's Rifles as a 2nd Lieutenant, attached, IARO, appointment date 13th Dec 1917. Can't see anything else.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ID: 10   Posted (edited)

Thanks you Steven, I struggled with the Indian Army List and never managed to get that :-)

 

So I have his commission date now.

 

What looks a little odd, and I do not understand the class structure of the Indian Army, is that he landed in France in AUG 1917 from MIC, but did not become a 2nd Lt until Dec

 

Is there a simple explanation for this. I did not think that he would have served in the Indian Army as an OR

Edited by corisande

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What's om his MIC as a unit?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

boyle-mic-front.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Interesting: the Indian Army (except cavalry and some support units) had gone from France by then. I wonder if he had a brief appointment with a British unit as part of his commissioning process.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That would seem the most logical answer, but with a name like his it is virtually impossible to find/prove

 

Nothing obvious in WO338

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dear corisande,

The British Library (India Office Library) have three or four volumes of Indian Army Reserve of Officers details, on the open shelves.

You could ask/eMail the BL directly or avail yourself of a researcher (as I do, living in Germany).

596a7d37cad8b_IAROentry.thumb.JPG.d7e74d7d535b1c6b553ef91673d18a27.JPGThe entries look like the attached.

Kindest regards,

Kim.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the tip, I will add that reference to my list for next time in TNA

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A Lieutenant John Boyle was admitted to the Indian Army Reserve of Officers on 29 July 1917 from the Cameron Highlanders, but the gazette notification was not published until 23 January 1920. https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/31751/page/989 the heading is on page 988.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Harry. That looks on balance of probability to be him. He was born in Glasgow so a commission in a Scottish Regt is certainly on

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Army List of March 1916 lists 2nd Lt. J. Boyle serving with 8th (Reserve) Bn. Cameron Highlanders with a commission date of 3 July 1915.

 

John Boyle was gazetted 2nd Lt. on the General List 3 July 1915 https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/29214/page/6444

 

Promoted to Lt., Cameron Highlanders, 1 January 1917 https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/30002/page/3004 Heading Cameron Highlanders on page 3003

 

There is a L.G. notification of him being actg. Capt. 1st Bn., 55th Coke's Rifles, attached from I.A.R.O. 12 - 30 Jan 1918 https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/32262/page/2227

 

Promoted Capt. I.A.R.O. 3 July 1919 https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/31942/page/6590

 

Relinquished his probationary appointment I.A.R.O. 28 October 1919 https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/32118/page/10864

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dear corisande,

The IARO volumes are at the BL (in the middle of London and a hassle to get registered, before admittance), not TNA (outlying Kew and far less trouble).

Having said that, Harry (well done, Mate!) has obviated the BL connection and solved your Boyle, IARO saga, in one fell swoop!

My researcher would charge me fifty quid for that, straight-away. Indeed, this demonstrates the beauty of the Great War Forum, from which I have profited time and time again, thanks to the expertise and generosity of members like Harry.

A large proportion of my medal collection are to the IARO, which are notoriously difficult to research. These adventurous types were called upon in their thousands to fill much-needed gaps, but their services went largely un-heralded, post-Great War.

Do you have Boyle's medals, one wonders...?

Kindest regards,

Kim.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Harry , Thank you, that is both impressive.and comprehensive. I had only half those LG entries, and hence was missing the whole picture that you have uncovered

 

Do I have his medals ? - answer is no, I do not collect medals (too poor!)

 

I am researching the 2000 or so ex-officers who joined the Auxiliary Division of the Royal Irish Constabulary. Having been through them all once - you can see how long it too, in that I started this thread 5 years ago. I do a mini CV on each, to try to get an overall picture of the background of the men who joined and what happened to them afterwards. The vast majority are researchable, but there are a few like John Boyle who has a very common name, and only one initial, who are difficult to follow. Put on top of that the difficultly of researching the IARO and I was getting nowhere.(until now)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, HarryBrook said:

The Army List of March 1916 lists 2nd Lt. J. Boyle serving with 8th (Reserve) Bn. Cameron Highlanders with a commission date of 3 July 1915.

 

John Boyle was gazetted 2nd Lt. on the General List 3 July 1915 https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/29214/page/6444

 

Promoted to Lt., Cameron Highlanders, 1 January 1917 https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/30002/page/3004 Heading Cameron Highlanders on page 3003

 

There is a L.G. notification of him being actg. Capt. 1st Bn., 55th Coke's Rifles, attached from I.A.R.O. 12 - 30 Jan 1918 https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/32262/page/2227

 

Promoted Capt. I.A.R.O. 3 July 1919 https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/31942/page/6590

 

Relinquished his probationary appointment I.A.R.O. 28 October 1919 https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/32118/page/10864

How does the system work that he was appointed Captain 3 July 1919 (someone else was appointed a temporary  Captain) yet he had a probationary appointment ? 

 

Cheers

Maureen

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dear Harry,

Thanks for finding and posting that.

The resignation under that of Capt Boyle is fascinating: IARO Second Lieutenant Valentine Patrick Terrel Vivian, OBE, and granted the rank of Major.

That is what I call a high-flyer!

Not to mention on the same page: Major and Brevet Lt.-Col. (temporary Brigadier-General) (now Colonel) R. B. Worgan, CSI, CVO, DSO, IA. The latter - at right - 596bc1dd2d0e3_PrinceofWaleswithColonelWorgan.jpg.a6da4142a8689ed7417bcb7e61bf7616.jpgwas in the Prince of Wales's entourage, and shot a tiger (attributed to the Prince, who missed). 

Kindest regards,

Kim.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dear GWFs,

As an aside, I found a picture of Major (later Colonel) Valentine Patrick Terrel Vivian, CMG, CBE, (1886-1969). 

Actually an Indian Police officer, at the time of his resignation from the IARO, he had served with the Indian Army in Turkey and Palestine - and had served in the Department of Criminal Intelligence at Simla, and retired from the Indian Police in 1925.

220px-Val_Vivian1.png.35bcd862f1e36f4089e20c9c143c8838.pngHe became the vice-chief of MI6, and selected Kim Philby, the double agent, causing great harm...

Kindest regards,

Kim.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now