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mva

postcards/photos of Eastern Somme from British soldiers

25 posts in this topic

for my research ( https://somme18.com/projet/ ), I found (Delcampe) about 140 postcards/photos of the villages here ( Roye, Moreuil) during ww1.  The ones I have were written/taken by French or German soldiers ; I never saw some written/taken by British (Commonwealth) soldiers, though they were here (many KIA in 1918). The only photographs I found are on the site of the IWM.  

Of course, I wonder why. AND : if some of you have such postcards/photos, I would be glad to include them on my blog (which is in the making). I don’t need the original pictures, just a scan, and would of course acknowledge where they come from.

Thank you very much, kind regards from the Somme, martine

of course, I see the topic ‘postcards’, but there are so many – it is difficult to find to which place they are related

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ID: 2   Posted (edited)

On 15 April 2017 at 06:08, mva said:

for my research ( https://somme18.com/projet/ ), I found (Delcampe) about 140 postcards/photos of the villages here ( Roye, Moreuil) during ww1.  The ones I have were written/taken by French or German soldiers ; I never saw some written/taken by British (Commonwealth) soldiers, though they were here (many KIA in 1918). The only photographs I found are on the site of the IWM.  

 

Of course, I wonder why. AND : if some of you have such postcards/photos, I would be glad to include them on my blog (which is in the making). I don’t need the original pictures, just a scan, and would of course acknowledge where they come from.

 

Thank you very much, kind regards from the Somme, martine

 

of course, I see the topic ‘postcards’, but there are so many – it is difficult to find to which place they are related

 

 

I am sure that forum members would like to help you if they can, Martine, but most 'postcard' images/photos of soldiers portray just the man and it is rare that the location is clear, or even mentioned.  Even so, I wish you good luck with your project.

Edited by FROGSMILE

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Thank you, Frogsmile, for this interesting answer. In the next days, I'll scan a few examples of what I have gathered. Could it be that British soldiers never sent a postcard home (when they were at rest, of course) from the place where they were ? Was it forbidden ? Of course, for all (all nations) soldiers it was forbidden to send during the fights. But some British soldiers surely have taken pictures or bought postcards ....

kind regards from the Somme, martine

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Here are some examples of what I mean :

https://somme18.com/from-my-collection/

As you see, 'testimonies' of soldiers who were here (where I live) during ww1 ; is it really possible that there are non similar ones from Commonwealth soldiers ?

In the archives of the Durham Light Infantry, there is a drawing of the church of my village, Arvillers, (can't find it just now), but there must be some other proofs of other Commonwealth soldiers being here ; of course, pics of the soldiers themselves is interesting, but the places where they were is important too !

Thank you in advance for your help, martine, in the Somme

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Thank you mva.

This area of France interests me, as it is the area in which my grandfather and his Mechanical Transport Company had to traverse in 1918.

His route took him from near Attilly on March 21st, Voyennes, Nesle, Carrepuis, Roye,passing through Montdidier on the 27th.

I see you have a card of French & British troops on the Amiens-Roye road on this day.

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51 minutes ago, Dai Bach y Sowldiwr said:

Thank you mva.

This area of France interests me, as it is the area in which my grandfather and his Mechanical Transport Company had to traverse in 1918.

His route took him from near Attilly on March 21st, Voyennes, Nesle, Carrepuis, Roye,passing through Montdidier on the 27th.

I see you have a card of French & British troops on the Amiens-Roye road on this day.

very interesting, Dai Bach y Sowldiwr ! French&Brit. troops on the Am-Roye road : I think this is a picture I found on the Imp.War Museum.

Montdidier & Roye are 15 km from where I live and I try to remember of the soldiers who were here March-Aug. 18. I already have found many (not everything is on the blog yet, but you can look at the pages which are already on line, some are provisory), with many informations about them in some cases.

Of course, if you agree, I would include details about your grandfather. Do feel free to contact me either here or in a pm.

Kind regards from the Somme, martine

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ID: 7   Posted (edited)

Thank you Martine,

Unfortunately I have no first hand evidence about my grandfather.

But I know that for the period February 1918- April 11th 1918, he was in 886 Company (Mechanical Transport) Army Service Corps.

This company was XVIII Corps Siege Park, 5th Army and they were very closely attached to the Siege Batteries that were in 65 Bde,RGA., and in particular to 118 Siege Battery.

Studying the war diaries for these units show the movement of the battery from Attilly, to Montidier as mentioned, and in later days the movement of 118 Siege Battery was as follows:

 

27/3/1918 Faverolles to Montdidier (66e.v.27)to Aubvillers (66e.o.8.d), La Neuville(-Sire-Bernard- 66e.i.29) (& Mailly-Raineval (66e.h.24.c)

28/3/1918 Mailly to Moreuil (66e.i.2.d)

29/3/1918 Moreuil to Roevrel (66e.h.3.c) to Jumel (66e.g.16.a) to Oresmaux (66f.l.3.c)

30/3/1918 Oresmaux to Taisnil (66f.d.11.a ) (?via Saint Sauflieu- HQ of SMTO of 886 MTC)

1/4/1918 Taisnil to Poix(-de-Picardie) (66f.b.28.a) to Sainte-Segrée (66f.g.10.d)

1-4/4/1918 Sainte-Segrée

5/4/1918 Sainte-Segrée to Gauville (66g.e.24.b) nr.Aumale

6/4/1918 Gauville to Hamicourt (57f.p.35.d)

 

The location of the MT Company HQ, and the Senior Mechanical Transport Officer for the Company were all slightly different as can be expected, but all were in these general locations at this time.

 

If you have images of these places from around this time, I would love to see them.

Edited by Dai Bach y Sowldiwr

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Did he survive ?

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5 minutes ago, mva said:

Did he survive ?

Yes he did, he was a caterpillar driver, pulling howitzers around.

65 Bde at this time was severely depleted, and moved north near Amiens for refitting.

My granfather was transferred in quick succession to III Corps, XIX Corps,4th Army Siege Park then Australian Corps in mid-May 1918 when 65 Bde was re-constituted.

At this time, the Australians were east of Amiens.

In June, he was moved up to the Ypres sector.

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Martine, unfortunately I don't think you will find that much. The British soldiers were not allowed to take photographs (although a few did secretly) so the majority which do exist are the official ones which are in the IWM.

 

For post cards, many of the villages in the eastern sector were fought over and uninhabited or with few shops open so local post cards would be difficult to obtain. Most cards sent by the British were from the back billeting areas, mainly west of Albert.

 

Wish you luck in finding some, Peter

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ID: 11   Posted (edited)

Thank you, Peter. But how come that many German @ French soldiers bought and sent postcards ???

Edited by mva
+ 1 word

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may be I should change (but how ?) the title and add : "drawings"

Here is a drawing of the church in my village, by a soldier of the Durham Light Infantry :

http://www.durhamrecordoffice.org.uk/article/11111?SearchType=Param&CatRef=D%2fDLI+7&ImagesOnly=Y&ImageView=List&Display=100&Page=29&ItemID=165140&ImageID=327398

 

(Reference: D/DLI 7/956/2(19)

Pencil sketch of a church and adjacent buildings, captioned: Arvillers Somme, France, n.d. [1917])

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3 hours ago, mva said:

may be I should change (but how ?) the title and add : "drawings"

Go to your first post.

Click on the "Edit" link  (underneath the post.

This will bring up the post, and the title.

You can edit the title there, then click the "Save" link.

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THANKS, Dai Bach y Sowldiwr, I'll do that !

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On 17/04/2017 at 15:47, mebu said:

Martine, unfortunately I don't think you will find that much. The British soldiers were not allowed to take photographs (although a few did secretly) so the majority which do exist are the official ones which are in the IWM.

 

Wish you luck in finding some, Peter

But : http://www.westernfrontassociation.com/great-war-people/research-family-story/book-reviews-1/6312-kodak.html

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Martine, yes Pocket Kodaks were used, but quite rarely as later they were banned by the Army.  It was feared that any photographs falling into enemy hands could give important information. The only photographers allowed were the official ones, whose works are now in the IWM.

Here is a little from a history of photography in WW1:

From 1916 onwards official restrictions on taking private photographs were increasingly enforced, and a few soldiers were court-martialled for owning cameras in a war zone.  (Stephen Badsey for British Library))

Hence there are not many photos to be found.

Similar thought was applied to postcards. These were often censored if any information could be obtained, as the the examples below:

One, on which has the sender has written his name and unit on the reverse,  with date, has Lihons censored.  The other, Herbescourt, is blank on reverse and is passed uncensored.

The Germans, who generally had permission to take photographs, had the eastern Somme villages as rear and billeting areas, whereas when the British held the villages they were generally empty. Not many postcard sellers there.

 

Peter

 

 

 

 

img025.jpg

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On 16 April 2017 at 17:46, mva said:

Here are some examples of what I mean :

https://somme18.com/from-my-collection/

As you see, 'testimonies' of soldiers who were here (where I live) during ww1 ; is it really possible that there are non similar ones from Commonwealth soldiers ?

In the archives of the Durham Light Infantry, there is a drawing of the church of my village, Arvillers, (can't find it just now), but there must be some other proofs of other Commonwealth soldiers being here ; of course, pics of the soldiers themselves is interesting, but the places where they were is important too !

Thank you in advance for your help, martine, in the Somme

 

The only example that I am aware of where the location of Photos is known is Vignacourt on the Somme.   The French farmer there who was also a photographer, do you know of the "lost Tommies", Martine? http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/articles/3LVxjjZghNQW2LJhx1SsX0t/the-lost-tommies

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Thank you, mebu & Frogsmile for your very interesting answers, mine soon (am in a hurry today)

kind regards from the Somme, martine

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On 20 April 2017 at 06:31, mva said:

Thank you, mebu & Frogsmile for your very interesting answers, mine soon (am in a hurry today)

kind regards from the Somme, martine

 

I just remembered that some British newspapers, especially the 'DAILY MAIL' produced a series of a great many WW1 photos that in some cases declared the location.  Copies are available.

Have you looked at the "Lost Tommies" photos from the Vignacourt farmer that I mentioned above, Martine?  They were found in trunks in the attic of the old farmhouse, where they had been since WW1!  A real 'time capsule'.

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ID: 20   Posted (edited)

I am sorry that I am still lacking time for a long answer ; I hope to do that next week. It is difficult to find out where troops where when it was quiet, for instance this (Roye 9/3/18) :

large_000000.jpg?action=e&cat=photograph
WORK OF THE AGRICULTURE DIRECTORATE ON THE WESTERN FRONT, 1914-1918. © IWM (Q 10279)IWM Non Commercial Licence

more to follow ! hopefully soon

Edited by mva
pb link

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On 20/04/2017 at 00:39, FROGSMILE said:

 

The only example that I am aware of where the location of Photos is known is Vignacourt on the Somme.   The French farmer there who was also a photographer, do you know of the "lost Tommies", Martine? http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/articles/3LVxjjZghNQW2LJhx1SsX0t/the-lost-tommies

Yes, Frogsmile, I had a look, what a pity that so little is known (date, regiment)

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32 minutes ago, mva said:

Yes, Frogsmile, I had a look, what a pity that so little is known (date, regiment)

 

That was just a small selection, I think Martine.  If you do an online 'search' for "the Lost Tommies" (maybe au Francais too), I think that you will find more.  I have obtained a book comprised of some of the photos and research has revealed some units, some names, and some dates.  However, the photos were all taken at Vignacourt (many within the farm complex), so in that context there is not so much variety.  Even so, there are some unusual images.

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15 hours ago, FROGSMILE said:

 

That was just a small selection, I think Martine.  If you do an online 'search' for "the Lost Tommies" (maybe au Francais too), I think that you will find more.  I have obtained a book comprised of some of the photos and research has revealed some units, some names, and some dates.  However, the photos were all taken at Vignacourt (many within the farm complex), so in that context there is not so much variety.  Even so, there are some unusual images.

just seen in todays local newspaper :

Mais pour Stéphane Ducrotoy, maire de Vignacourt, la vague émotionnelle déclenchée aux antipodes il y a six ans par la diffusion d’un reportage sur la collection des plaques photographiques de la ferme Thuillier, vaut bien ces efforts.

= There will be a museum for those photos

 

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56 minutes ago, mva said:

just seen in todays local newspaper :

Mais pour Stéphane Ducrotoy, maire de Vignacourt, la vague émotionnelle déclenchée aux antipodes il y a six ans par la diffusion d’un reportage sur la collection des plaques photographiques de la ferme Thuillier, vaut bien ces efforts.

= There will be a museum for those photos

 

 

That is good to know Martine, thank you.  The survival of the glass plate images through another world war is incredible. I hope that you will get the chance to see them.  It was tragic that Monsieur Thuillier eventually committed suicide.

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ID: 25   Posted (edited)

(still in a hurry, but ...)

http://www.somme14-18.com/visite-du-ministre-dan-tehan-somme

no time to translate, but it is about those Thuillier photographs ( & Naours)

Edited by mva
cplts

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