314 replies to this topic

[Rockdoc]

Lancashire Fusilier, on 25 January 2012 - 02:05 AM, said:

Motorcycle mounted machine gun in action - Cigarette Card No.6

Looking back through the thread I realised that this is a Scott motorcycle. I would not have thought they would have been used by the military as they were water-cooled, two-stroke twins and, as a consequence, would have been very vulnerable to damage. I'd guess that this is a photo of a demo of the principle.

Keith

[centurion]

Rockdoc, on 08 March 2012 - 08:41 AM, said:

Looking back through the thread I realised that this is a Scott motorcycle. I would not have thought they would have been used by the military as they were water-cooled, two-stroke twins and, as a consequence, would have been very vulnerable to damage. I'd guess that this is a photo of a demo of the principle.

Keith

Scott designed and built a machine gun carrier based on  a his motorcycle. It was trialled but not adopted. He went on to build further 3 wheeled mg carriers (and I think the armoured thingy I posted a photo of a few days ago was one of these). They were trialled by the army but again not adopted but formed the nucleus of the design of the post war Scott Sociable.
Scott motor cycles seem to have been built well into 1915 but I've seen a mention that they went to police forces and not the military.


Another problem with the Scott was that the model produced in 1914 tended to emit significant white smoke from time to time which would have made it easier to spot in the battle area.

[Rockdoc]

The whole design of the Scott seems unsuitable for the kind of inevitable neglect and hard use a 'bike will get in a war situation. Its frame is distinctly odd, having no top-tube, so it would have to be more liable to flexure and, thereby, fatigue fracture if used over rough ground all the time. The radiator is right behind the front wheel and low down, which is not a problem on roads but on bad ground where things stick up at odd angles? And it's a two-stroke and, as you say, will emit white smoke on a more or less continuous basis. They would have been fairly easy to work on because the big-ends are on the outside faces of the two flywheels and replacing the roller bearings is easy but access is via a door on each side of the crankcase and keeping those well sealed - essential on a two-stroke, of course - wouldn't be easy if you were working in a dusty or even grubby environment. If I remember correctly, something that would have made life at the front interesting is the gearbox drive. In the back of my mind I think it's chain driven, which is normal on most bikes, but it ran from the middle of the crankshaft to the middle of the gearbox. Accessibility is not enhanced....... Then there's the fact that bikes of the period didn't have air filters. Suck some grit into a side-valve engine's carburettor and the worst you'll do is make the valve stick. Grit flying about in an oily, sticky atmosphere inside the crankcase of a two-stroke sounds like grinding-paste to me.

The Scott company were undoubtedly innovative but I have my doubts about such a machine's reliability in much less than ideal conditions.

Keith

[centurion]

Rockdoc, on 08 March 2012 - 07:50 PM, said:

The Scott company were undoubtedly innovative but I have my doubts about such a machine's reliability in much less than ideal conditions.

Probably why the army rejected it - but they did trial it





Scott appears to have gone off the rails a bit in 1914 and if he hadn't left the company to set up a seperate Scott company to develop 3 wheelers (which couldn't hold a candle to the Morgans) the post war Scotts would probably never have been.




I'm a Douglas and James fan myself

[centurion]

Further to the pigeon lofts this may be of interest

http://3.bp.blogspot...on+birdcage.jpg

Can any one id the 3 wheeler?

[Lancashire Fusilier]

WW1 Military Motor Cycle & Sidecar combination.

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[RobL]

Nice - late war Douglas 4hp. Regarding the German three wheeler, there's a photograph of one driving through a shelled town in the Bart Vanderveen book

[centurion]

RobL, on 12 March 2012 - 07:27 AM, said:

Nice - late war Douglas 4hp. Regarding the German three wheeler, there's a photograph of one driving through a shelled town in the Bart Vanderveen book

That's a Phanmobil and a different vehicle altogether.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Another photograph showing more details of the Armoured Vehicle shown in post # 203.

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[Lancashire Fusilier]

Kugelpanzer Predecessor of WW1

By request of the German War Ministry, an armored vehicle project put forward in 1916-1917 to the German commercial firm of the Bremen Hansa-Lloyd Works. They were to design a battlewagon,G ermany's one and only “big wheel” design, which progressed further than its British counterpart.

The Treffas-Wagen was finished on February 1, 1917. It had two large steel wheels, roughly 11 feet in diameter, on each side of a rectangular armoured body. At the rear was a large castor-like roller for steering. In front of the body was a 20 mm TUF gun, with machine guns on either side for firing into trenches. The crew consisted of four men. The Treffas-Wagen weighed 18 tons. One prototype was built, and thoroughly tested during February and March of 1917.

Meanwhile, a decision was made in favor of the A7V. The Treffas-Wagen was not developed any further and was dismantled in October of 1917.

LF

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[phil w]

centurion, on 09 March 2012 - 12:27 AM, said:

Further to the pigeon lofts this may be of interest

http://3.bp.blogspot...%2Bbirdcage.jpg

Can any one id the 3 wheeler?

As far as I am aware the only two German makers of this type of three wheeler were Cyklonette and Phanomobile. It does not look like a Phanomobile but I have never seen an illustration of a Cyclonette so I cannot comment as to whether it is or not.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Clyno motorcycle combinations mounted with Vickers machine guns.

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[RobL]

Very nice, I haven't seen that photograph before, where is it from?

[Lancashire Fusilier]

RobL, on 11 April 2012 - 11:28 AM, said:

Very nice, I haven't seen that photograph before, where is it from?

Yes a great photograph, and I had not seen it before either. At the moment, I cannot remember where I saw it, when I do remember, I shall get back with you.
Regards,
LF

[Lancashire Fusilier]

With reference to Card No.20 - post # 82 - Flying Corps Motor.

Illustration from War Illustrated 1915 - Vol. 1, depicting a French aircraft mechanics crew fighting off German Uhlans attacking Captain Gerard's aircraft whilst it was on the ground, thereby allowing Captain Gerard time to get airborne. Once airborne, Captain Gerard was also able to attack the Uhlans.
French pilots had a crew of aircraft mechanics who followed them around in specially equipped vehicles containing a spare aircraft engine, spare propellers contained in special boxes either side of the vehicle, and other spare parts needed to keep the aircraft flying.

LF

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[Lancashire Fusilier]

Admiralty pattern Rolls-Royce Armoured Car.

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[Lancashire Fusilier]

Admiralty pattern Armoured Car captured by the Germans.

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[cdr]

Lancashire Fusilier, on 18 April 2012 - 01:57 AM, said:

Admiralty pattern Rolls-Royce Armoured Car.

Nice picture but not in France ! This is in front of my local town hall (Gent in Belgium) and probably dates from 07/10/1914
Carl

[Lancashire Fusilier]

cdr, on 18 April 2012 - 05:30 AM, said:

Nice picture but not in France ! This is in front of my local town hall (Gent in Belgium) and probably dates from 07/10/1914
Carl

Carl,
Many thanks for pointing that out, we all know you can never trust photograph captions 100%.
Regards,
LF

[kiwifrog]

Not an armoured vehicle but a supply truck of some sort. This is a photo I rescued from being thrown away by one of my old neighbours. I know absolutley nothing about it



Kind regards

Alan

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Captain Albert Ball V.C., D.S.O ( 2 Bars ) M.C. at the wheel of his wartime Morgan Grand Prix 3 wheeler.
Captain Ball had ordered the special bodied Grand Prix of which he said "to drive this car was the nearest thing to flying without leaving the ground".
Sadly, Captain Ball was killed in action in 1917 shortly after taking delivery of the car.

Does anyone know what became of this car after Capt. Ball's death ?

LF

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[phil w]

kiwifrog, on 29 April 2012 - 07:44 AM, said:

Not an armoured vehicle but a supply truck of some sort. This is a photo I rescued from being thrown away by one of my old neighbours. I know absolutley nothing about it



Kind regards

Alan

A post war pic of a 'demobbed' army lorry perhaps? It is a bit unusual in that the cast wheels are AEC/Daimler but the bonnet and radiator mostly resembles a Halley which had chain drive. There is what appears to be a civilian registration plate fixed to the front of the radiator also the background is a long way from any war front.

[kiwifrog]

phil w, on 30 April 2012 - 04:30 PM, said:

A post war pic of a 'demobbed' army lorry perhaps? It is a bit unusual in that the cast wheels are AEC/Daimler but the bonnet and radiator mostly resembles a Halley which had chain drive. There is what appears to be a civilian registration plate fixed to the front of the radiator also the background is a long way from any war front.

Maybe a war surplus hybrid made from a couple of damaged trucks ?  Would the passengers/driver be military ? And does the non blacked out bottons indicate peacetime dress ?  I am a complete novice at all this but I am sure I read somewhere the buttons and cap badges were blacked out/made non shiny during times of war, or is that another myth. I have to admit I am learning an awful lot of interisting things on this forum

Alan

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Quote

Would the passengers/driver be military ?
Alan

Alan,
The driver and his passengers are certainly military, and look to be Army Service Corps ( ASC ) whom you would expect to see driving such vehicles.
LF

[phil w]

Lancashire Fusilier, on 30 April 2012 - 08:57 PM, said:

Alan,
The driver and his passengers are certainly military, and look to be Army Service Corps ( ASC ) whom you would expect to see driving such vehicles.
LF

The driver is the one in the centre, the soldier on the left is standing on the drivers running board. The civilian standing in front may well be the driver/owner of the vehicle. There is also no sign of a 7 digit serial number which you would expect to find on an army lorry.