15 replies to this topic

[TRAJAN]

Hi one and all,

I have two metal scabbards with bad dents, one an ersatz, the other a Lebel. An enquiry on the GBForum about how to remove these came up with an ingenous-sounding solution apparently applied to removing dents in cars after they have been hit by hail stones (hey, everything's bigger in the US of A - unless pressed sheet steel in cars is thinner!). Namely, heat the affected area with a hair dryer, and then cool it suddently with freezing air/water, after which the dent 'pops out'  (quote/unqoute).  

Well, I get the idea (while not understanding the mechancal factors involved), and I can enviage using the approach when my other half and nippers are out - hair dryer in  the kitchen then stick the warmed scabbard in the freezer... But before doing this,  does anyone on GWForum have any comments? Any at all will be greatly appreciated!

Trajan

[auchonvillerssomme]

Larger dents in metal bayonet or sword scabbards are usually put there on purpose by the serviceman for 2 reasons, one it stops the blade rattling in the scabbard, and it holds it in more securely.

[truthergw]

Something that works on an area of about a square metre ( very roughly) may not succeed on a small and sharp curved piece of metal like a scabbard. I don't suppose it will harm it though so you can only try.

[Pavster1980]

Hello

I have seen this done using a can or compressed air as the coolant


Rich

[TRAJAN]

auchonvillerssomme, on 13 March 2012 - 06:24 PM, said:

... Larger dents in metal bayonet or sword scabbards are usually put there on purpose by the serviceman for 2 reasons, one it stops the blade rattling in the scabbard, and it holds it in more securely.

"Yeah, but, I mean, yeah, but..." Meaning, point taken , BUT the 'but' here is that: (I), the ersatz scabbard was bought as a spare, and has the sawback throat, but although I can get my 98/05's ohne sawbacks into it I can't get my scabbardless sawback 98/05 more than 2/3rd's there because of the dent, which resists the teeth; and (II), the Lebel came with a scabbard but the patina marks indicate that it has for a long time been 1/8th out of the scabbard (as it is now) because of the dents lower down, and I would like to get it in a little bit further... if you get my drift!

Trajan

[pbrydon]

Somebody once told me of a way to get dents out of metal sword scabbards which involved filling the scabbard with sand to just above the dent and then tapping a flat metal object with something heavy ( a hammer ? ) on the surface of the sand.The theory being that the pressure created on the sand will force out the dents.

Whilst I was assured that this works,I would not recommend this method unless someone is able to confirm that they have used it and that it works.

P.B.

[TRAJAN]

pbrydon, on 13 March 2012 - 06:43 PM, said:

... Somebody once told me of a way to get dents out of metal sword scabbards which involved filling the scabbard with sand to just above the dent....

That sounds plausible - just! The one apparently guaranteed way of achieving my desired aim - or so I have been told - is to do what they used to do. Make a metal blank the exact same size as the bayonet, heat the scabbard (I gather from a photo I have seen that the Germans in WWI used a blow torch), then hammer the blank in, and bob's your uncle!

BUT, I certainly don't want to use a blowtorch on one of my scabbards (would a hair-dryer work?), and I don't really want to risk getting a blank stuck in either of them...

Trajan

[Reese]

I don't think a hair dryer is going to generate any where near the amount of heat you'll need. Also you don't want to put the scabbard in the freezer, you just want to rapidly cool the spot of the dent. The way scabbards are/were repaired by armourers was as described above. A mandrel shaped to the dimensions of the inside of the scabbars, not the shape of the blade, is forced into the scabbard. Once in place the dents can be hammered out against the mandrel.

[auchonvillerssomme]

TRAJAN, on 13 March 2012 - 06:39 PM, said:

"Yeah, but, I mean, yeah, but..." Meaning, point taken , BUT the 'but' here is that: (I), the ersatz scabbard was bought as a spare, and has the sawback throat, but although I can get my 98/05's ohne sawbacks into it I can't get my scabbardless sawback 98/05 more than 2/3rd's there because of the dent, which resists the teeth; and (II), the Lebel came with a scabbard but the patina marks indicate that it has for a long time been 1/8th out of the scabbard (as it is now) because of the dents lower down, and I would like to get it in a little bit further... if you get my drift!

Trajan

Thats what you need.....a drift!

[TonyE]

Exactly the same method using a mandrel was used to repair bren gun magazines.

Regards
TonyE

[TRAJAN]

auchonvillerssomme, on 15 March 2012 - 04:17 PM, said:

Thats what you need.....a drift!

And now for something a little more serious - thanks for the suggestions re: using a mandrel - just not happy about the using the hammer bit! Oh, and Reese, thanks for advice re: heating and then "you just want to rapidly cool the spot of the dent": this sounds like the voice of experience speaking - is that so?

Cheers and thanks everyone,

Trajan

[33rd div mgc]

TRAJAN, on 16 March 2012 - 05:21 AM, said:

And now for something a little more serious - thanks for the suggestions re: using a mandrel - just not happy about the using the hammer bit! Oh, and Reese, thanks for advice re: heating and then "you just want to rapidly cool the spot of the dent": this sounds like the voice of experience speaking - is that so?

Cheers and thanks everyone,

Trajan

As a ex engineer by trade and worked with metals most of my life, the mild steel of the scabbard will be worked without the use of any heat....As above, you will need to make a mandrel and gently tap it into the scabbard, this will force out the dent, then gently hit the dent with a set of car body working hammers, there is a flat hammer to do this type of job.
Don't forget to leave enough length of the mandrel to be able to pull it out....

Dickie

[TRAJAN]

Thanks Dickie! Just one more question about the mandrel... Would an aluminium one work or do I need a steel version? Or even, perhaps, a suitable hard wood? I'm just wondering what I can get hold of and where - yes, Turkey is still full of artisans of all trades, but it's a question of finding the right one and the right material...

Trajan

[ph0ebus]

TRAJAN, on 16 March 2012 - 10:40 AM, said:

Thanks Dickie! Just one more question about the mandrel... Would an aluminium one work or do I need a steel version? Or even, perhaps, a suitable hard wood? I'm just wondering what I can get hold of and where - yes, Turkey is still full of artisans of all trades, but it's a question of finding the right one and the right material...

Trajan

Just be sure to use a mandREL, and not a MandRILL:



The latter don't take too kindly to being hit with hammers...



Keep us posted on the results!

-Daniel

[TRAJAN]

ph0ebus, on 16 March 2012 - 12:52 PM, said:

...The latter don't take too kindly to being hit with hammers...

Well, that nose makes him look a wee bit on the hammered side - perhaps after a few 'boilermakers'???!!!

Trajan

[33rd div mgc]

TRAJAN, on 16 March 2012 - 10:40 AM, said:

Thanks Dickie! Just one more question about the mandrel... Would an aluminium one work or do I need a steel version? Or even, perhaps, a suitable hard wood? I'm just wondering what I can get hold of and where - yes, Turkey is still full of artisans of all trades, but it's a question of finding the right one and the right material...

Trajan

You would need to make one from a peice of steel bar as it will take the knocking....aluminium would be a little too soft, so would a hard wood.
I've made some up in the past and used them....If you have problems, I might be able to help you out.
Cheers
Dickie