18 replies to this topic

[annieb22]

I wonder if anyone might be able to tell me what this badge or brooch is. It's amongst some items that my brother has had handed down to him and I am trying to work out who it might have belonged to and what exactly it was.

[roughdiamond]

Signallers trade badge.

Sam

[JulesW]

Almost certain the signaller's insignia. worn lower left sleeve indicates passed annual test. Upper right sleeve for instructor.

I feel Grumpy coming along any moment!

[annieb22]

That helps. It must have been my grandpa's. He was a despatch rider in the Royal Engineers Signals Sub-section according to his de-mob chitty. Was this an official badge that they wore?

The reason I ask is that we also have some sort of tag thing (see below) which I believe was not official (or am I wrong about this) and so I wondered about the other badge as I couldn't seem to find anything about it online.

[munster]

Hi annieb and welcome
His Mic is on ancestry below,The identity disc is a private purchase item, the trade badge was official and part of his uniform.john
http://search.ancest...alRolls&indiv=1
Below is example of official issue id tags.
http://www.flickr.co...ion/4103087243/

[annieb22]

JulesW, on 06 June 2012 - 09:25 PM, said:

Almost certain the signaller's insignia. worn lower left sleeve indicates passed annual test. Upper right sleeve for instructor.

Can you tell me what the annual test would have involved? My grandpa joined the telephone service in 1914 when he left school. He enlisted in the army on 6th Nov 1916 shortly before his 18th birthday and was mobilized on 1st March 1917. His rank was a Sapper. My dad was told that grandpa was a motorcycle despatch rider, which I understand was attached to the signals section. I'm surprised though that he wasn't more to do with the telephones/telegraph in the war because of his job in civvy street or might he have been involved with that too?

[annieb22]

munster, on 06 June 2012 - 10:14 PM, said:

His Mic is on ancestry below,The identity disc is a private purchase item, the trade badge was official and part of his uniform.john
http://search.ancest...alRolls&indiv=1
Below is example of official issue id tags.
http://www.flickr.co...ion/4103087243/

Thanks John. Yes, I have the medal index card and my brother has grandpa's medals.

I have 3 photos of grandpa in uniform, one is a head and shoulders shot so I can't see any badges on his arm. Another image shows him sitting cross-legged with some sort of gun but again, difficult to see any badges. The last one is a photo of him on a motorcycle wearing a sort of overcoat, cap and gloves. The sleeves of this coat appear to have something on them just above the elbows - sort of like two horizontal large strips. I'm not sure if that is significant or whether these strips were just for visibility so someone would see him (although that sounds counter-productive so I'm probably wrong). As you can tell, I'm just beginning to learn.

My brother also has a red tag like the one you linked to, John, for my great-grandfather on my mother's side.

[centurion]

Not so much an ID disc as an ID bracelet.
The two strips you mention are probably the edges of a brassard worn over the arm by signallers.

[roughdiamond]

annieb22, on 06 June 2012 - 10:29 PM, said:

The sleeves of this coat appear to have something on them just above the elbows - sort of like two horizontal large strips. I'm not sure if that is significant or whether these strips were just for visibility so someone would see him (although that sounds counter-productive so I'm probably wrong). As you can tell, I'm just beginning to learn.

Not the photo I was looking for which has a clearer view, but were the stripes like those on the sleeve of Arthur Halestrap below, the last surviving Royal Engineer from WW1 who was a Signaller?



This is a better photo, hand coloured by the look of it, I'm sure the Blue and white armband was to distinguish them as R.E. Signallers as opposed to other specialist R.E. trades.

[annieb22]

This is the photo of grandpa on his bike on my family history website: http://www.hibbitt.o..._/hibbitt/0047/ (I can't tell what colour the stripes are. I'd also be interested in knowing what the cap badge might have looked like as it's not clear in the original photo.)

Here's the head and shoulders picture: http://www.hibbitt.o..._/hibbitt/0045/ (I can't make out what the thing is on the left lapel or what the wire-like thing is underneath it which seems to go under his arm).

Below is the last photo. (I'm interested in what the gun was and what the thing is he's wearing across his chest like where a sash would be.)

Is there anything on any of these pictures which offers any more information about my grandpa's service please? I believe, from his de-mob certificate, he was attached to the RGA. Is there anything on a uniform which would confirm this?

Thanks all for your help so far.

[Edward1]

Cap Badges for Royal Engineers
Eddie

Attached Files

•  The Corps of Royal Engineers050_edited-1.jpg   86.07K   1 downloads

[annieb22]

Thanks for the cap badge pictures, Eddie. They are rather handsome looking objects.

This is the best I can get my grandpa's to look. It seems almost to be a cross between the two. Was there a difference between them?

[Gunner Bailey]

annieb22, on 06 June 2012 - 09:52 PM, said:

That helps. It must have been my grandpa's. He was a despatch rider in the Royal Engineers Signals Sub-section according to his de-mob chitty. Was this an official badge that they wore?

The reason I ask is that we also have some sort of tag thing (see below) which I believe was not official (or am I wrong about this) and so I wondered about the other badge as I couldn't seem to find anything about it online.

This is a privately purchased ID Disc. This sort were worn with a watch strap or sometimes under a wrist watch. Bearing in mind that wrist watches were rare than, this is quite a progressive purchase.

John

[annieb22]

Gunner Bailey, on 07 June 2012 - 10:20 AM, said:

This is a privately purchased ID Disc. This sort were worn with a watch strap or sometimes under a wrist watch. Bearing in mind that wrist watches were rare than, this is quite a progressive purchase.

John

That is nice to know, thank you.

Everyone is so friendly and helpful on this forum. I'm putting together a project on my grandpa's war service for my dad's birthday which is tomorrow, hence all the questions as I try to finish it in time. I've been doing a bit more reading around the subject and have a few more questions if that's OK.

• Did anyone manage to confirm the brassard thing in the photo below? What were they for?
  
• Does the cap badge in my fuzzy picture above match those of the RE Signals Section?
  
• Is my grandpa sitting on a Triumph Model H bike?
  
• And is the rifle my grandpa's holding in the other picture of him above, a SMLE MarkIII or III* or something different again? Is the thing across his chest for holding the ammunition, sorry I don't know the correct terminology but am enjoying finding out.

[roughdiamond]

annieb22, on 07 June 2012 - 11:34 AM, said:

That is nice to know, thank you.

Everyone is so friendly and helpful on this forum. I'm putting together a project on my grandpa's war service for my dad's birthday which is tomorrow, hence all the questions as I try to finish it in time. I've been doing a bit more reading around the subject and have a few more questions if that's OK.

• Did anyone manage to confirm the brassard thing in the photo below? What were they for? Almost 100% it's to distinguish him as a RE Signaller as in the photo's I posted.
  
• Does the cap badge in my fuzzy picture above match those of the RE Signals Section? RE Signals section Didn't have a different Cap badge, it was a standard issue, the difference between the 2 is that filligree'd (can't think of a better term) one was the standard Cap badge, from 1916, the plain stamped "economy" Cap badge started being issued due to the ease, cheaper cost of it's production and the quantities required (during WW2 there were even plastic versions) I know because I'm ex-RE and collected the different versions. You can pick one up cheaply on e-bay, if you do make sure it's a "V" in the centre not a "VI" which was from WW2.
  
• Is my grandpa sitting on a Triumph Model H bike?
  
• And is the rifle my grandpa's holding in the other picture of him above, a SMLE MarkIII or III* or something different again? Is the thing across his chest for holding the ammunition, sorry I don't know the correct terminology but am enjoying finding out. Across his chest is a bandolier for holding ammunition

[annieb22]

Thank you roughdiamond. It's nice to think Arthur Halestrap was doing the same sort of thing as my grandpa. That reminds me, I must get round to reading my 'Britain's Last Tommies' book.

It isn't easy to see but I think my grandpa has got the later 'economy class ' cap badge. That would make sense as he didn't enlist until Nov 1916, just before he was 18.

[JulesW]

hello again, I will look into nature of signaller test. Just know about the badge 'cos my dad's brother was a signaller and died of wounds 1917, Ypres.
Certainly included installation,repair and maintenance of telephony land lines with proficiency in morse code and semaphore.
My money is on 1915 Triumph H

I found this a good read royal-signals.org.uk/Datasheets/Visual%20.php

[centurion]

annieb22, on 07 June 2012 - 11:34 AM, said:

• Did anyone manage to confirm the brassard thing in the photo below? What were they for?

Brassards are consistent with those issued to signallers. I think they told military policemen and the the like "don't hold up these guys unless you really have to".

[annieb22]

Thanks to everyone here for your help. My dad was really pleased with his present.