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Tralee Military Cemetery


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#1 Boreenatra

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Posted 19 July 2004 - 03:10 PM

Please may I open by saying as a new member TGWF is a credit to you all,
and to the people we remember.I have posted a query to the soldiers board,but
does anyone have any info re the Tralee Military Cemetery in Killerisk Road ,Tralee
Co.Kerry.GGGF Pte John Guerins 5189 depot Royal Munster Fusiliers is there and we found him courtesy of CGWC.web site and we visited there two weeks ago and
managed to talk to the caretaker there who told us as far as he knew there were just individual stones with the usual regimental insignia and details/dates/ages etc. but he was told there no actual burials there(this is what he was told).As this place
is on private property,and this man was on his way to a funeral that day,we couldn't get much information from him.CGWC says there are 10 memorials there(we only saw 8) but our question is what is the criteria for being buried in a military
cemetery when ,although the RMF barracks were in Tralee,our John lived many miles away in Dungarvan Co.Waterford.The other memorials there inlcude the Yorkshire Regiment,the Canadian Infantry,the New Zealand Field Artillery,amongst others.(There are 5 RMF'S there)Although the cemetery in total is only an acre in size(the military bit is very small) is it normal practice for these places to be in private hands?It is not normally open to the public but we were allowed a quick
look.When are the stones placed there(John's date on the stone is 23rd March 1915) and were the families offered free burials in the barracks town rather than send one back to their own families?And why so few memorials here (10 or 8 depending on your point of view) in a place where many thousands of local men must have perished,but all of these men here seem not to be local men.Please forgive these basic questions (i'm sure you've been asked before) but it could be a simple answer but we don't know.P.S. what were the criteria for medals in WW1.John does not seem to appear in the Medal Search at the NA.Thanks in advance for any answers you may have and again a truly great site Regards Steve

#2 Boreenatra

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Posted 19 July 2004 - 03:11 PM

Regards Steve

#3 Terry Denham

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Posted 19 July 2004 - 03:23 PM

Steve

If you only saw eight CWGC stones, you have to remember that the other two are probably private headstones and can be anywhere in the cemetery.

Relatives of casualties who died in their home country were allowed to select the private option if they wished and about 20% did so. CWGC is not responsible for the maintenance of private war grave headstones but this does not affect their status as official war graves.

When a man died in the UK, his relatives could select the place of burial but had to pay the cost of transporting the body. Many could not do this and the casualties were buried where they died. Otherwise, the burial site is the choice of the next-of-kin.

#4 Boreenatra

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Posted 19 July 2004 - 03:28 PM

Dear Terry.Thanks for your reply.Where there the same options for men killed overseas/Regards Steve

#5 Terry Denham

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Posted 19 July 2004 - 03:33 PM

Steve

No.

Only n-o-k of men who died in their home country could choose the burial site or whether to have a private memorial or not. Prior to mid-1915 bodies could be brought home for burial (if you could afford it) but only about sixty (all officers) were before it was banned.

A few private memorials were erected on the Western Front and elsewhere before the rules were formalised but most of these were removed later.

#6 Boreenatra

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Posted 19 July 2004 - 03:35 PM

Again thanks for your reply.Regards Steve

#7 Deleted_Brummy_*

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Posted 19 July 2004 - 04:17 PM

QUOTE (Boreenatra @ Mon, 19 Jul 2004 16:11:33 +0000)
managed to talk to the caretaker there who told us as far as he knew there were just individual stones with the usual regimental insignia and details/dates/ages etc. but he was told there no actual burials there(this is what he was told).As this place
is on private property,and this man was on his way to a funeral that day,we couldn't get much information from him.

Steve,

unless it states otherwise on the headstone, for example beleived to be buried in this cemetery or something simular there will be bodies underneath the markers.

Brum

#8 museumtom

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Posted 19 July 2004 - 05:10 PM

Hello again 'little road to the strand'. I have the list and location of the War Graves in the cemetery, if you post the names of the soldiers that you are trying to find I will tell you where they are buried.
Tom in Tipperary.

#9 Boreenatra

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Posted 20 July 2004 - 12:41 PM

Tom.Thanks for your post.I have recieved some other information from my man "embedded" in Tralee Council.Hopefully this may help anyone else who is researching Tralee Military Cemetery.In reply to Terry,there are two more memorial stones(making 10 in all) but they are away from the other 8(we couldn't see them in the short time we were there),and in fact the whole site is a military cemetery.There were no burials there after 1922 when Ireland became a republic,so we had misunderstood the original information we were given,unless the stone is of a later date(date on stone 23rd March 1915) In general terms how long after death were the stones usually erected?The caretaker there Mr. Boyle is happy for people to visit,but he needs prior written notice(there is no phone there)so people don't turn up and find it locked as it is at all times.In answer to your question Tom, it was really only John Guerins we were looking for there,however anyone else can find as we did the others details thru CGWC,however Middle Section Right etc isn't always that helpful.Also to Terry, your reply re men who died at home,would that include men brought home from war thru injury as well as men who died while still in the U.K./Ireland.I ask this because at this time we know nothing about John's military record,we don't even know if he even left the country(would that explain the lack of medals?)My spy is sending me a survey map from the 1860.s which may give us some more information about the cemetery and also will be seeking out an ally who is a local archivist who may be able to shed some more light on this place.It used to be in a road called Haigh's Terrace(renamed Killerisk Road.)I hope this info is of some help to others and please pass on any other info re Pte John Guerins/Tralee Military Cemetery. Regards Steve

#10 Terry Denham

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Posted 20 July 2004 - 12:54 PM

Steve

The CWGC stones were not available until 1919 onwards. The process of erecting them was a long one and stretched through the 1920s and 1930s.

These could easily have been erected after the separation of Ireland in 1922. This would have made no difference.

Relatives of all men/women who qualified for war grave status and who died in their home country gained the added concessions of choosing the burial location and whether to have an official stone or not.

It did not matter how they died if they were serving at the time of death. So some would have died of illness or due to accident/suicide/homicide as well as those who died of wounds.

Of course, at the time of WW1, Ireland was an integral part of the UK and so counted as 'home' for all war grave purposes.

#11 Boreenatra

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Posted 20 July 2004 - 01:31 PM

Terry.Thank you for the courtesy of your reply.Regards Steve

#12 Boreenatra

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Posted 20 July 2004 - 05:33 PM

Terry.Thanks again for your help.Do you know if there are dates for the stones being erected,and also before the stones,were there if any, markers to show who was where.Regards Steve

#13 museumtom

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Posted 20 July 2004 - 05:36 PM

Steve, there are others here who know a lot more about the CWGC than myself and I am sure they will jump in a enlighten you.
Sorry I am not that well up on the burying thing and marking.
Tom

#14 Terry Denham

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Posted 20 July 2004 - 05:36 PM

CWGC may have a record of when the first stone was erected. Email them on casualtyenq@cwgc.org

There probably was no stone put there by the family although there may well have been some form of temporary marker.

#15 Boreenatra

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Posted 21 July 2004 - 08:10 PM

Can anyone elaborate on the subject of Death Plaques and scrolls please?...my GGfather appears to have died 'at home' in WW1 and presumably if there were no medals a plaque may have been issued then...? Any details ( a picture?) of these awards would be very helpful....Regards, Steve

#16 ChrisC

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Posted 23 July 2004 - 11:52 PM

Hope this helps
Chris

#17 ChrisC

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Posted 23 July 2004 - 11:56 PM

oops - didn't work! Try again. It's supposed to be the plaque and paperwork for my Great Grandad.