11 replies to this topic

[Sommewalker]

Okay, no firm identification on my studded trench club, so here's another. A standard German M.90 lance with an unusual steel ball beneath the point.  It appears to be factory fitted but I have never seen another.  The lance itself has the usual inspection stamp - Crown over W 14 and is marked to a mounted Jager unit.  Anyone any ideas on this? SW

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[khaki]

I don't recall seeing that before, is it removable? general concept is to prevent excessive impaling of the victim and prevent the lance being becoming "stuck" which would either cause the abandonment of the lance or possibly pull the rider from the saddle.

khaki

[Cnock]

Hi,

these lances with a ball were used for training,

Cnock

[Sommewalker]

Cnock, on 14 April 2012 - 06:06 PM, said:

Hi,

these lances with a ball were used for training,

Cnock

Do you have any source for that which I could quote?  I ask because the addition of the ball doesn't really affect the operational length of the point as it is fitted only about 15 mm above the first mount for the pennon.  I suppose it would help a novice by preventing a through and through penetration.   And, no Khaki;  The ball is very closely fitted and held by a transverse rivet, so it would not be quickly removeable. SW

[khaki]

Cnock, on 14 April 2012 - 06:06 PM, said:

Hi,

these lances with a ball were used for training,

Cnock

Hello Cnock,

I don't doubt your information and reply, but  I am curious as to why you would add a ball to a 'live blade' and how that would assist in training unless for balance?

khaki

[truthergw]

I believe that a hazard for the inexperienced was getting the lance and even the sabre, too deep. This could unseat the rider. The ball would prevent that, I suppose but a pig sticker had a crosspiece for the same job. Presumably the ball is hollow?

[Sommewalker]

Yep -just pressed sheet steel. Cnock's assertion does make sense, but it makes one wonder why they weren't all so fitted as it doesn't affect the lethality.  It is also completely opposite to British practice where these 'stops' were only fitted to lances when they were used operationally.  See the photos taken of the Deccan Horse immediately before the action at High Wood. SW

[khaki]

truthergw, on 14 April 2012 - 06:53 PM, said:

I believe that a hazard for the inexperienced was getting the lance and even the sabre, too deep. This could unseat the rider. The ball would prevent that, I suppose but a pig sticker had a crosspiece for the same job. Presumably the ball is hollow?

My understanding of the cross piece on a boar lance or pig sticker was to prevent  an enraged charging boar, even though impaled, continuing to run 'up the lance' and still do nasty things to the lance holder. Sorry I am getting 'boaring' just thought I would mention it.

khaki

[Sommewalker]

On consideration if one was practising on straw dummies or something similar such a device would prevent a through penetration which in those circumstances would be undesirable. I think Cnock is on the ball - and I have learned something. -  thank you. SW

[truthergw]

khaki, on 14 April 2012 - 07:26 PM, said:

My understanding of the cross piece on a boar lance or pig sticker was to prevent  an enraged charging boar, even though impaled, continuing to run 'up the lance' and still do nasty things to the lance holder. Sorry I am getting 'boaring' just thought I would mention it.

khaki

Is that not the same problem as going too deep?

[Cnock]

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Sommewalker has it right

Cnock

[khaki]

truthergw, on 14 April 2012 - 10:32 PM, said:

Is that not the same problem as going too deep?

Essentially it is, except in the military sense the lancer could just loose his weapon or be unseated, and in the civilian sense the hunter could be injured or killed by the animal.

khaki