10 replies to this topic

[MartinBennitt]

The excellent 'Now All Roads Lead to France: the Last Years of Edward Thomas, by Matthew Hollis says on page 230, referring to summer 1915:

'Zeppelins were coming to London. Thomas wrote to Frost on 1 June. The capital was bombed the night before and gripped now by the panic buying of gas masks ' (my italics). Was just wondering whether only weeks after the first gas attack on the Western Front, when gas masks for the troops were still rudimentary, what was available in London, and whether there were really any German plans to use gas against civilians. Was there indeed panic buying, and of what?

cheers Martin B

[RobL]

I've come across gas masks being issued to public in the UK before, so would be interested in seeing whether either statement is true

[Simon Jones]

Various types of gas mask were sold by firms such as Boot and Harrods from May 1915 which relatives sent out to soldiers at the front. None would have worked and the Army had to ban them. They were then marketed as protection against gas from Zeppelin raids with numerous advertisements in the press.  I am not aware that the Germans seriously intended to use gas from Zeppelin bombs given that the quantities would have been so minute.

[centurion]

Simon is correct - delivering gas by aircraft would have been ineffectual before the introduction of nerve gasses as it would have been impossible to build up enough concentration to have any appreciable effect

[Doc2]

centurion, on 12 July 2012 - 10:39 AM, said:

Simon is correct - delivering gas by aircraft would have been ineffectual before the introduction of nerve gasses as it would have been impossible to build up enough concentration to have any appreciable effect

Some nations certainly didn't think so--- the first nerve agent was developed about 1936, but was not in real production until WW2.  However, the Italians used aerial delivered gases (probably mustard) in Ethiopia in 1935-6, and also I think in Libya prior to that. It may have been inefficient, but not really "ineffectual" on a small scale.  The Spanish used mustard from the air in their interwar efforts in North Africa, according to what I have read.  The Germans dropped mustard from the air on Warsaw in 1939 (though they later claimed that was an accident).  The French certainly saw a potential aerial gas threat during the inter-war years.

I agree that it was probably pretty ineffectual in most instances, until the development of nerve agents, but the concern on the part of the civilian populace can be understood.  They didn't really know how inefficient such delivery would be.  On the other hand, inefficient weapons still can kill, if you are unfortunate enough to be close to where the "inefficient" weapon is dropped.  "I'm not worried about the bullet with my name on it-- what scares me is the one labelled 'to whom it may concern'".

[Terry_Reeves]

Britain experimented with the nerve agent Hydrogen Cyanide from aircraft  in WW1, this being carried out by Lt F A Brock RNAS over the Thames Estuary. The idea was abandoned however as  a large amount is required to enter the blood stream to become an effective killer.

TR

[MartinBennitt]

Thanks for the info. I also wondered how the gas might be delivered, given that in May 1915, unless mistaken, only cloud gas was in use on the Western Front, though I guess the Germans were already contemplating using shells. Companies jumping on the bandwaggon with useless products doesn't surprise me either.

cheers Martin B

[NigelS]

I must admit to being a bit puzzled  as to why there should have been 'panic buying of gas masks'  - although there might have been of the materials to make them - as only weeks previously details of how to make a very basic 'home made' type  from readily available materials had been given  so that an appeal by the War Office to the public  for  the manufacture of 500,000 such 'respirators'  for use on the WF, could be met. From The Times of 28th April '15:

RESPIRATORS WANTED

APPEAL FOR HOME-MADE APPLIANCES

The War Office issues the following communication:-

As a protection against the asphyxiating gases being used as a weapon of warfare by the Germans supplies of one or both of the following types of respirator are required by the troops at the front.

Either can be made easily in any household:-

First: A face piece (to cover mouth and nostrils), formed of an oblong pad of bleached absorbent cotton-wool about 5¼in x 3in x ¾in covered with three layers of bleached cotton gauze and fitted with a band, to fit around the head and keep the pad in position consisting of a piece of 1/2in cotton elastic 16" long, attached to the narrow end of the face pad so as to form a loop with the pad.

Second: A piece of double stockinette 9½in long, 3½in wide in the centre gradually diminishing in width  to 2½ in at each end with a thick piece of thick plaited worsted about 5in long attached at the end so as to form a loop to pass over the ear.

These respirators should be sent in packages of not less than 100 to Chief Ordnance Officer, Royal Army Clothing Department, Pimlico.

(if it's to be believed, according to reporting on the 30th April, such was the enthusiasm for this project, the requirement had  been met by  the 29th, with the  suggestion that the surplus would be going towards a similar requirement for the Belgian Army )

Although these designs were only ever going to be a stop gap for infantry use, not knowing any better, the public,  having recently been involved in supplying them for use at the front (even if they weren't that effective there), would probably have considered them adequate for  any gas threat from Zeps, etc. This appears to be reflected in an advice given on air raids given by the Commissioner of the Metropolitan Police in The Times of the 15th June:

…Many inquiries have been made as to the best respirator. To this question there is no really satisfactory answer, as until the specific poison used is known  an antidote cannot be indicated. There are many forms of  respirator on the market for which special advantages are claimed,  but the Commissioner is advised by competent experts that in all probability a pad of cotton-waste contained in  gauze to tie round the head and saturated with a strong solution of washing powder would be effective as a filtering medium  for noxious gases, and could be improvised at home at trifling cost. It should be damped when required for use and must be large enough to protect the nose as well as the mouth, the gauze being so adjusted as to protect the eyes…

It may have been - unlike today - responsible reporting, but there is no mention (least that  I've noticed) in The Times of that period of shortages or panic buying of gas masks.

Incidentally, the Belgian army settled on its own specification (given in a request for 100,000 made on behalf of the Belgian Army Fund by 'Miss Haldane' on the 15th May):

...consists of black cotton net, which is tied around the man’s head. It is folded to form a pocket, which being filled with medicated cotton waste, fit’s over the man’s  mouth and nose protecting him from fumes To make the respirator you take a yard of net of net (small medium mesh).  Let it be half a yard wide. You fold over  a strip of the width  4½in. wide, to form the pocket, fold it over again  the same width to strengthen it, and the sew up the sides of the pocket, the length of which  must be 9in and the width 4½in . This leaves a length of net on either side of the pocket 13in long. The remaining strip above the pocket is used to protect the eyes.

The pocket is filled with cotton waste, but as this has to be chemically treated at the office of the Belgian Soldiers’ Fund before being sent to the front , we shall be most grateful to any of your readers who, instead  of buying the cotton waste for themselves, will send a subscription for it and for the chemical solution with which it is to be treated.

The respirator must, of course, have an outer case or envelope in which it can be carried about. This case is made  of waterproof  jackinet, American cloth, oil silk, or any other light waterproof material. If of American cloth, the brown side must be within, and it must be sewed with oiled needles to prevent rotting. The case must be 8in long by 5in wide and the upper flap which fastens  down over it like an envelope is 4in wide.

NigelS

[MartinBennitt]

NigelS, on 12 July 2012 - 02:48 PM, said:

It may have been - unlike today - responsible reporting, but there is no mention (least that  I've noticed) in The Times of that period of shortages or panic buying of gas masks.
NigelS

Weren't there regulations (e.g. the Defence of the Realm Act) against tendentious reporting?

cheers Martin B

[David Underdown]

Doc2, on 12 July 2012 - 11:03 AM, said:

Some nations certainly didn't think so--- the first nerve agent was developed about 1936, but was not in real production until WW2.  However, the Italians used aerial delivered gases (probably mustard) in Ethiopia in 1935-6, and also I think in Libya prior to that. It may have been inefficient, but not really "ineffectual" on a small scale.  The Spanish used mustard from the air in their interwar efforts in North Africa, according to what I have read.  The Germans dropped mustard from the air on Warsaw in 1939 (though they later claimed that was an accident).  The French certainly saw a potential aerial gas threat during the inter-war years.

The use of chemical agents by the RAF in Iraq in the 1920s was certainly considered (with Churchill's OK), but it's not clear that they were ever actually used (though a number of people have claimed they were)

[centurion]

All this reminds me of Bahrain just after the Iraqis had invaded Kuwait and there were fears of a chemical attack on the island. Various embassies and consulates began handing out gas masks to their nationals who were residents A colleague was Indian by birth but married to an Irish citizen. The Indians offered him a gas mask  of WW2 vintage (at least in terms of capability) whilst his wife was given a full NBC set of gear. He rapidly availed himself of his rights as an Irish spouse and got his own NBC kit. As it was the Iraqis didn't have any missile capable of hitting the island anyway (A single Al Hussani managed to drop about a mile short later in the conflict)