32 replies to this topic

[FamilySearch]

I have several photos that I am trying to identifiy the uniforms in.  Can anyone please help?

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•  George Brown and James Leys.jpg   95.32K   1 downloads

[munster]

No photos yet.

[FamilySearch]

pic 2

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•  William James Sinkins & sons2.jpg   43.87K   0 downloads

[FamilySearch]

pic 3

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•  William James Sinkins & sons.jpg   72.12K   1 downloads

[roughdiamond]

Do you have a family name and possible forenames? Pic 2 BTW is Royal Navy.

Are the men British or Canadian?

Sam

[FROGSMILE]

The uniforms are all British but the pictures are so pixelated (as if from a newspaper) that the badges are little but an outline.

[FamilySearch]

roughdiamond, on 11 July 2012 - 06:56 PM, said:

Do you have a family name and possible forenames? Pic 2 BTW is Royal Navy.

Are the men British or Canadian?

Sam

They are British Scots.  In the first picture, George Brown (left, half-brother to my g grandfather who is on the right) and James Henry Leys.  Rumor has it that, James Leys was in the Royal Navy and was lost at sea.  Unfortunately, I have blown this theory out of the water since I have records showing he was in the RFA and Tank Corps leading to his demise in 1918.  He must have left the Navy and joined the front lines.

Pic 2 is James Henry Leys and cropped from a picture containing pic 3 as well.

Pic 3 - I am trying to figure out which brother to my g grandmother this is.  She had 5 brothers who served (Surname: Sinkins).  3 in the Royal Navy.  One was in the Australian Army and one in the 48th Highlanders (Toronto, Canada).

Thanks for the help

[FamilySearch]

FROGSMILE, on 11 July 2012 - 07:23 PM, said:

The uniforms are all British but the pictures are so pixelated (as if from a newspaper) that the badges are little but an outline.

I have the actual photos.  It looks pixelated due to the forum not allowing me to upload the size of the actual scan.  I had to crop them in order to downsize the file.

[Michelle Young]

1st picture the man with the cap is in a Light Infantry regiment but it isn't clear enough to distinguish which one

Michelle

[FROGSMILE]

Michelle Young, on 11 July 2012 - 07:49 PM, said:

1st picture the man with the cap is in a Light Infantry regiment but it isn't clear enough to distinguish which one

Michelle

I agree that the badge shape appears to be that of a bugle Michelle.  What is throwing things is the large 'blob' at the top that one would assume is a crown or the top part of the bugle.  Only the DLI had a crown at top and the blob appears too large to be just the top of a bugle.

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•  durham_light_infantry_badge1.jpg   81.78K   0 downloads

[munster]

Is the badge a grenade and flame with a scroll below.john

[FROGSMILE]

munster, on 11 July 2012 - 08:06 PM, said:

Is the badge a grenade and flame with a scroll below.john

I did ponder on that John, but the only examples I can think of are the Royal Dublin Fusiliers and the 25th (Frontiersmens) Battalion of the Royal Fusiliers and neither of them seemed quite right.

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•  royal_dublin_fusiliers.jpg   50.74K   0 downloads

[Suddery]

I'd go with RDF, simply on the basis that it is the least dissimilar (if you catch my drift)for No.1 and 1914 pattern(Celtic Strap)Tyneside Scottish NF for picture number 3. The cap badge seems a blurred match just a shame about the collar badges, although I have read there was some latitude with regard to the latter.

Not confident on either - are we absolutely certain they're not Canadian ?

Suddery

[FamilySearch]

Suddery, on 11 July 2012 - 08:31 PM, said:

I'd go with RDF, simply on the basis that it is the least dissimilar (if you catch my drift)for No.1 and 1914 pattern(Celtic Strap)Tyneside Scottish NF for picture number 3. The cap badge seems a blurred match just a shame about the collar badges, although I have read there was some latitude with regard to the latter.

Not confident on either - are we absolutely certain they're not Canadian ?

Suddery

The gentlemen in Pics 1 & 2 were born in Scotland and never made it to Canada or the States for that matter.  In Pic 1, I do know the gentleman on the right was in RFA MGC, the Tank Corps, and Royal Navy.  In regards to the gentleman on the left, I do have a photo of a memorial made by his family in Scotland that has his service, but the photo is too distant to read.  All that I can make out is that it begins with a "C."  Cavaliers, maybe?  I am not familiar with the British Military at all.

In pic 3, this gentleman was born in England and the photo was taken in Scotland.  I don't know if it helps, but in the full photo his pants are wrapped with some type of material from below the knee down to the ankle.

[FROGSMILE]

FamilySearch, on 11 July 2012 - 09:17 PM, said:

The gentlemen in Pics 1 & 2 were born in Scotland and never made it to Canada or the States for that matter.  In Pic 1, I do know the gentleman on the right was in RFA MGC, the Tank Corps, and Royal Navy.  In regards to the gentleman on the left, I do have a photo of a memorial made by his family in Scotland that has his service, but the photo is too distant to read.  All that I can make out is that it begins with a "C."  Cavaliers, maybe?  I am not familiar with the British Military at all.

In pic 3, this gentleman was born in England and the photo was taken in Scotland.  I don't know if it helps, but in the full photo his pants are wrapped with some type of material from below the knee down to the ankle.

The 'C' might perhaps relate to Cameron Highlanders and that would fit with the Tam-o-Shanter bonnet but then so it would with most of the Scottish Regiments, but the C is then a distinct clue.  Another possibility although much less likely is the Cameronians (Scottish Rifles), as they generally wore black buttons.

The gentleman RFA/MGC, Tank Corps and RN does not make any sense at all based on the shape of badge seen in your photo.  If you have the original photo it will help greatly if you can examine the badge through a powerful glass (like a stamp collectors magnifier) and describe it to us?

[gordon92]

FamilySearch, on 11 July 2012 - 09:17 PM, said:

The gentlemen in Pics 1 & 2 were born in Scotland and never made it to Canada or the States for that matter.  In Pic 1, I do know the gentleman on the right was in RFA MGC, the Tank Corps, and Royal Navy.  In regards to the gentleman on the left, I do have a photo of a memorial made by his family in Scotland that has his service, but the photo is too distant to read.  All that I can make out is that it begins with a "C."  Cavaliers, maybe?  I am not familiar with the British Military at all.

In pic 3, this gentleman was born in England and the photo was taken in Scotland.  I don't know if it helps, but in the full photo his pants are wrapped with some type of material from below the knee down to the ankle.

Regarding the Scot on the left in picture #1, the "C" could represent either the Cameronians (Scottish Rifles) or the Cameron Highlanders.  I think I can discern some curvature on his shoulder title although this is far from certain because of the blurriness.  The Cameron Hldrs shoulder title would be a curved 'CAMERON' while the Cameronians (Scottish Rifles) title in this era would be a straight 'SR.'  The Cameron Highlanders appears to me as the higher likelihood.  Further, a Cameronian soldier would probably have blackened buttons on his jacket, but that is not a certainty as shortages occurred.

Can you tell from the full picture if he is wearing a kilt?

[FamilySearch]

FROGSMILE, on 11 July 2012 - 09:54 PM, said:

The 'C' might perhaps relate to Cameron Highlanders and that would fit with the Tam-o-Shanter bonnet but then so it would with most of the Scottish Regiments, but the C is then a distinct clue.  Another possibility although much less likely is the Cameronians (Scottish Rifles), as they generally wore black buttons.

The gentleman RFA/MGC, Tank Corps and RN does not make any sense at all based on the shape of badge seen in your photo.  If you have the original photo it will help greatly if you can examine the badge through a powerful glass (like a stamp collectors magnifier) and describe it to us?

Thank you so much.  Just figured out George Brown in 1st pic.  You were correct when you said the Cameronians.  I have located him in the 1911 census at the Muance Barracks in England.  He is listed with the 2nd Battalion Scottish Rifles.  Thank you for the lead on this one.  I will try to dig out the photo from storage and see if I can get a better look at my g grandfather's badge.

gordon92, on 11 July 2012 - 09:59 PM, said:

Regarding the Scot on the left in picture #1, the "C" could represent either the Cameronians (Scottish Rifles) or the Cameron Highlanders.  I think I can discern some curvature on his shoulder title although this is far from certain because of the blurriness.  The Cameron Hldrs shoulder title would be a curved 'CAMERON' while the Cameronians (Scottish Rifles) title in this era would be a straight 'SR.'  The Cameron Highlanders appears to me as the higher likelihood.  Further, a Cameronian soldier would probably have blackened buttons on his jacket, but that is not a certainty as shortages occurred.

Can you tell from the full picture if he is wearing a kilt?

As he is standing behind his sister and mother in the photo, it blocks his legs.  Though if I had to guess, it doesn't appear to be a kilt.

[roughdiamond]

FamilySearch, on 11 July 2012 - 07:46 PM, said:

They are British Scots.  In the first picture, George Brown (left, half-brother to my g grandfather who is on the right) and James Henry Leys.  Rumor has it that, James Leys was in the Royal Navy and was lost at sea.  Unfortunately, I have blown this theory out of the water since I have records showing he was in the RFA and Tank Corps leading to his demise in 1918.  He must have left the Navy and joined the front lines.

Pic 2 is James Henry Leys and cropped from a picture containing pic 3 as well.

Pic 3 - I am trying to figure out which brother to my g grandmother this is.  She had 5 brothers who served (Surname: Sinkins).  3 in the Royal Navy.  One was in the Australian Army and one in the 48th Highlanders (Toronto, Canada).

Am I reading this right, your saying the man on the right of pic 1 and in pic 2 is the same man? I can't see it, the man in pic 2 looks far older than the one in pic 1 and the cap badge is neither RFA or Tank Corps. Are you 100% James Henry Leys RFA and Tank Corps is your James Henry Leys, the National Archives of Scotland list him as born "Holborn, Aberdeen" http://www.snwm.org/...=view&id=130213

As for the man in pic 3, the cap badge could be 48th Highlanders, but the collar dogs are wrong, they should be like the ones in the link http://pipesforfreed...S_OF_CANADA.htm

FROGSMILE, on 11 July 2012 - 08:14 PM, said:

I did ponder on that John, but the only examples I can think of are the Royal Dublin Fusiliers and the 25th (Frontiersmens) Battalion of the Royal Fusiliers and neither of them seemed quite right.

I also originally thought RDF, but the scroll doesn't curve enough.

Sam

[FamilySearch]

roughdiamond, on 11 July 2012 - 11:40 PM, said:

Am I reading this right, your saying the man on the right of pic 1 and in pic 2 is the same man? I can't see it, the man in pic 2 looks far older than the one in pic 1 and the cap badge is neither RFA or Tank Corps. Are you 100% James Henry Leys RFA and Tank Corps is your James Henry Leys, the National Archives of Scotland list him as born "Holborn, Aberdeen" http://www.snwm.org/...=view&id=130213

Yes, I am 100% certain that this is the same man in both pictures.  In the first picture he is with his mother and siblings.  In the second picture he is with his father-in-law and brother-in-law.  As for him being in the Tank Corps, I am certain of this too as my grandmother (his daughter, also born in Aberdeen) had a picture of a memorial in Scotland that the family made and it says "In Loving Memory of our dear sons, Pvt. Geo. Brown - C.........(unreadable) Also James Leys - Tank Corps - Killed in France."  It is a little confusing and after speaking with my mother earlier this evening she explained according to rumor he was in the Royal Navy and was ordered to stay at sea but he did not.  His men were starving and so he returned which insued a court martial against him.  He was tired of waiting for trial and decided to enlist in the Army.  This is yet another timeline puzzle I have to figure out.

[roughdiamond]

From your post above I surmise George Brown Was KIA? Was he born in Scotland? The reason I ask is this is the only George or G Brown of the Cameronians (none in the Cameron Highlanders) KIA according to CWGC http://www.cwgc.org/..., GEORGE ARTHUR and he was 2nd Bn, but according to the Scottish National War Memorial (SNWM) http://www.snwm.org/...n=view&id=74184 he was born in London.

If this isn't him and he was born in Aberdeen, could this be him http://www.cwgc.org/...WN, GEORGE PAUL George Paul Brown? Unlikely as he'd be too young to be a Regular in 1911. Or this George Brown http://www.cwgc.org/...7/BROWN, GEORGE These are the only 2 of 67 George Brown's listed on the SNWM as born Aberdeen.

If none of these are him, do you know where and when George was born?

Sam

[FamilySearch]

roughdiamond, on 12 July 2012 - 03:09 AM, said:

From your post above I surmise George Brown Was KIA? Was he born in Scotland? The reason I ask is this is the only George or G Brown of the Cameronians (none in the Cameron Highlanders) KIA according to CWGC http://www.cwgc.org/..., GEORGE ARTHUR and he was 2nd Bn, but according to the Scottish National War Memorial (SNWM) http://www.snwm.org/...n=view&id=74184 he was born in London.

If this isn't him and he was born in Aberdeen, could this be him http://www.cwgc.org/...WN, GEORGE PAUL George Paul Brown? Unlikely as he'd be too young to be a Regular in 1911. Or this George Brown http://www.cwgc.org/...7/BROWN, GEORGE These are the only 2 of 67 George Brown's listed on the SNWM as born Aberdeen.

If none of these are him, do you know where and when George was born?

Sam

Well, I thought the last one was definitely him, but according to the family grave marker he would have died in France...not Egypt.  He was definitely born in Aberdeen between 1892-1893.  His parents were George and Euphemia Brown.

[roughdiamond]

FamilySearch, on 12 July 2012 - 03:48 AM, said:

Well, I thought the last one was definitely him, but according to the family grave marker he would have died in France...not Egypt.  He was definitely born in Aberdeen between 1892-1893.  His parents were George and Euphemia Brown.

Do you know if he married and to whom?

Sam

[FamilySearch]

roughdiamond, on 12 July 2012 - 04:37 AM, said:

Do you know if he married and to whom?

Sam

I have no idea.  There has never been anything said about him other than he died during the war.

[Verrico2009]

FamilySearch, on 11 July 2012 - 07:49 PM, said:

I have the actual photos.  It looks pixelated due to the forum not allowing me to upload the size of the actual scan.  I had to crop them in order to downsize the file.

If you want to email them to me I'll post them on my Flickr account and place the link here (they'll be marked private so no link, no view).  I'll PM you with my email address.

[Verrico2009]

http://flickr.com/gp/louiq/0Y7V54

http://flickr.com/gp/louiq/bb2UPu

http://flickr.com/gp/louiq/561RYk