30 replies to this topic

[4thGordons]

For what it's worth my guess would be that this is an early war picture of trainees on a route march or, conceivably a pre war picture of TF troops on a route march at a summer camp in the summer of 1914 - of which large numbers exist.
The picture I use on my website is one example(bottom picture of a coy. resting on a march)

I agree with SS that troops actually deploying would have had ammunition pouches on.

The caption "Volunteers ready to be shipped to Belgium"  does not really make much sense in itself does it? If the idea is that these were WARTIME volunteers (ie people who had signed up after the outbreak of war) - I should think the number of men who volunteered in 1914 with no previous service who made it to F&F in 1914 would be small. Of course at that point (pre conscription) I suppose "volunteer" applied to the entire British Army - but the sense of the caption / picture could be (tough to tell without the full context) "Volunteers [completing their training in preparation for being] ready to be shipped to Belgium" as opposed to "This is a picture of troops about to board a train/boat to Belgium"

My sense from the picture is that it is the former.

One additional piece of circumstantial evidence for this, in addition to the absence of ammunition pouches, is the presence of quite a large number of civillians (or at least men in civillian dress) I count perhaps eight?
More likely to be present in a break in a training march through local towns than in the actual execution of a deployment overseas I would have thought.
just my 2p
Chris

[Chris_Baker]

Local archives for Lyndhurst or the New Forest might have a copy, if it is the 2nd Queens.

[Jack Sheldon]

Thank you one and all for the various suggestions. One two interesting areas to follow up there.
Jack

[Suddery]

If it is the 2nd and they were looking a little 'rag tag' and outdated then I'd not be surprised.

According to the 'History' (Col H C Wylly - page 84/85) they left Bermuda, after 2 years service there, on 21/1/14 and embarked for Durban, thence by train to Pretoria arriving 19/2/14. On 19/8 they then left Pretoria arriving in Cape Town on the 22nd inst. They then spent 5 days on the Troopship 'Kenilworth Castle' in Table Bay. On 2/9/14 they arrived in St Helena before eventually reaching Southampton on September 19th and then trudged off to Lyndhurst. On October 4th they then received orders to March to Southampton (a logistical nightmare as many were on leave - they subsequently embarked in 2 parties probably as a result of this) which was partially achieved; the first party embarking that night for Zeebrugge via Dover. Both parties seem to have arrived at 7th Division HQ at Oostcamp (via train) by October the 7th.

I'd be amazed if they had up to date webbing etc after all of that, if they did then their respective QM's must have been pretty exceptional. I know little about the orders standing for the issue of ammunition but personally I'd have been tempted to blow my brains out after all of that - obviously the Queens were made of stronger stuff. Flippancy aside presumably the diaries might indicate ammunition issue.

If this adds nothing to the identification debate I apologise but it does show just what these men had to endure before they even reached Flanders. It may also explain aged equipment.

Suddery

[TRAJAN]

Suddery, on 20 July 2012 - 05:15 PM, said:

... If it is the 2nd and they were looking a little 'rag tag' and outdated then I'd not be surprised....If this adds nothing to the identification debate I apologise... It may also explain aged equipment...

No need for aplogies! That bit of detail does add to explaining why some Queen's men in 1914 might have 'outdated' equipment!

Trajan

[Suddery]

This is a photo from my collection of a Queens band, somewhere in France, date unknown. This is not one of the London Battalions.

Thought it might be useful for purposes of comparison.





Suddery




I'm afraid I'm watermarking all of my photos being considered for future publication after finding one where I did not expect or want it to be. I've a posting related to this under 'Watermarking'.

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