23 replies to this topic

[dundeesown]

In the DundeeTelegraph tonight a story about the desecration of the War Memorials in and around Dundee has this picture to go with the story,but what has the lad on top of his helmet ? any ideas ?
 fallen.jpg   92.78K   35 downloads
Gary.

[THE SHINY SEVENTH]

Could it be the hessian cover for helmet rolled up and tied in place? Regards Sean

[Joe Sweeney]

I think it might be a ratty Hessian cover with the one side that is not attached well being blown by the wind.

Other than that it might be a proto punk with an attached Mohawk adornement.

Joe Sweeney

[THE SHINY SEVENTH]

Joe Sweeney, on 10 August 2012 - 05:40 PM, said:

it might be a proto punk with an attached Mohawk adornement.

Joe Sweeney

I think I prefer this answer

[old owl]

Joe Sweeney, on 10 August 2012 - 05:40 PM, said:

Other than that it might be a proto punk with an attached Mohawk adornement.

Joe Sweeney

"Put that man on a charge S'arnt Major."

[dundeesown]

So we are going for a cover or Hawkeye
Gary

[Mike_H]

That is a well used photo, I reckon it is a retouch that does not appear in the original.

ike

[munster]

looks like the cover on the man nearest camera helmet is on the way off.john

[Steven Broomfield]

dundeesown, on 10 August 2012 - 07:47 PM, said:

So we are going for a cover or Hawkeye
Gary

Don't see Hawkeye helping. No way that's LBW.

[dundeesown]

( Hawkeye ) as in last of the Mohicans.

[Bootnecks]

I've seen this picture so many times now over the years, and it still facinates me for some unexplained reason. The whole image that this chaps helmet portrays is so sureal! Personaly, I tend to agree with 'Mike_H'. I do not think that its a part of the period original. Let me try and explain what I mean. Study the details of the items in the photograph, especially those that produce a shadow. Try and imagine the supposed item on the helmet, and visualise the shadow it would produce if it were to be in a certain angle.. say, either rolled up, or just being lifted by the wind! The item is supposed to be some form of helmet cover. The shadow to the right of the helmet addition actually curves away to the right of the helmet from approx the center. Yet the item on the helmet remains at the center. Also, the shadow does not follow what is actually being shown, and appears far to haevy. If you also look a little closer at the supposed cover, it is a series of heavy upward strokes, each stroke equal to the next... not natural, but consistant with a pencil.  All this leads me to believe that this is indeed a touched up photograph. A bit of artistic license perhaps? But for what reason? That I'm sure will be debated till the cows come home!

Seph

[FROGSMILE]

Personally I think it is just the expedient way that he found to carry a rolled/folded sand bag intended for a specific task.  We know that each wave had extra equipment specified for carriage forward.

[brucehubbard]

dundeesown, on 11 August 2012 - 11:03 AM, said:

( Hawkeye ) as in last of the Mohicans.

Then he must be Uncas

Bruce

[skipman]

Does anyone know who took the original, and is this from same series Click ?

Mike

[Bootnecks]

Yes Mike... it is from the same series.

Seph

[skipman]

Cheers Seph. It's the Somme right? Is it Brooks?

Mike

[Bootnecks]

To tell you the truth Mike... I could not even guess at the photographers name. I have seen this series before though.. many times. If your able to study the actual series, you'll see that quite a few of the shell bursts are pencilled in. Quite common at the time, to sensationalise the shots for the general public. If that were actually the second wave going in... you'd not find the photographer standing where he is. There would be to much lead coming his way. This is actually reinforcements strolling up after the heaviest of the fighting as moved on. The series pans to the right, and the stretcher bear can clerly be seen in a few of the shots dissapearing in the distance. It is the Somme though, but what part, and at what point in the battle is not that clear.

Seph.

[FROGSMILE]

I agree that it could quite easily be (and probably is) a contrived scene for the cameras, but that does not stop the soldiers from being dressed and equipped as stipulated by their particular unit and formation for the advance.  That said I guess we will never know the truth of it.

[Bootnecks]

Quite true.... we may never know!

[skipman]

The photograph appears on page 223 of The Illustrated War News Vol 2

Virtual Library

Mike

[Chris CPGW]

skipman, on 02 November 2012 - 07:43 PM, said:

Does anyone know who took the original, and is this from same series Click ?

Mike

Mike, thie "stretcher bearer" photo is part of the the IWM collection No Q1309. Battle of Morval 25-28/09/16, by Lt Ernest Brooks.

Link http://www.iwm.org.u...bject/205193940

Regards

Chris

[skipman]

Thanks Chris. The image (Battle of Morval) doesn't seem to be available, I think this is the closest Click i wonder if it's in the original?

Mike

[dundeesown]

Thanks for all the links lads.
Gary.

[GRANVILLE]

I thought I'd bring this one back to life after I just read a one-liner in 'Realities of War' by Philip Gibbs which I'm reading yet again. On page 214 Gibbs is writing about Royal Fusiliers & Northumberland Fusiliers coming back from taking German trenches at St Eloi in 1915 when he writes: "Some of them had shawls tied to their helmets". Nothing more is said about it, but it was obviously unusual enough for him to have noted and commented on it. Any thoughts anyone?

David

PS I perhaps should have added that in the previous sentence he states: "Their steel helmets were covered with sand bagging......". So whatever the shawls were about they presumably were not to do with camouflage?