Zut alors!

Suddenly my wife has found an interest in the GW and is mainly interested in the archeaology and visiting current digs.

Are they well advertised and are De Diggers still doing their wonders?

Regards
paul

There are several sights in this country and even some current forums on this website. Take a look at "Stow Maries Home Defence Aerodrome" for example.

I noticed the Diggers-website is offline. Bad news?

Roel

Nope I was speaking to Frans the other day and he did not mention any bad news regarding the diggers.

Dan

Paul,

If you're not already aware of it, you & your good lady might find this blog worth keeping an eye on http://plugstreet.blogspot.com/

NigelS

I'm not an archaeologist, but I use some archaeology websites for our project. I'm afraid I can't offer any ideas on areas outside the UK.

I understand that Oxford Archaeology were the body who investigated the former WW1 camp at Kinmel. (I was told this by CPAT.) Their website is here and if you put 'volunteers' into the search box, some opportunities are shown. I haven't looked to see whether they are relevant to the Great War.

Then there is archaeology.co.uk, which has a section called 'Join In'. You can search by area under 'Search for fieldwork'. There is a lot of interesting material on there.

I have also found CPAT helpful. I should think that if you followed links to other local heritage and archaeology trusts, you might find someone seeking volunteers for local Great War based projects in the UK. There are four Welsh Archaeological Trusts (Gwynedd, Glamorgan-Gwent and Dyfed).

I hope someone with professional knowledge may be able to give you guidance. My contact with archaeology has been from my interest in the Anglo-Saxons and living in the Oxford area for a time - a thousand years too early for you!

Gwyn

I had a look at archaeology.co.uk and found a couple of local archaeology groups who I will be contacting. Well done Dragon.

http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/i...=119475&hl=

My Dutch is far from fluent, Dan, and we await a synopsis from one of the forum's Dutch speakers, but the newspaper article and Dutch WW1 forum discussion linked to in that thread do not appear to be 'good news' from the Diggers' perspective. From what I can glean, they have been ordered to desist from both archaeological and ordnance detection activities.

Can one still go and visit de Diggers on a Saturday afternoon?

Matt

Currently there is no digging by the De Diggers at present.


John

"No Mans Land" were excavating round a British bunker near Saint-Yvon at the weekend, the farmer was damaging his ploughs on the buried steel and concrete remains. So NML have taken the opportunity to check the site out before the farmer removes the obstruction. By now it will probably have been filled in the team having completed the site investigation.
I do have photo's, but have yet to download them to my pc
regards
Tom

There are some photos of the Saint-Yvon excavation up on the Plugstreet Blog - Here

Brian

Thanks for the replies
I would really like to get out there when there is a dig going on but for obvious reasons they are not advertised due to plunderers going in overnight when there is nobody there!!

Paul

Afternoon All

I'm pleased to say that we did have a succesful long weekend at St Yvon excavating the concrete megalith and the trenches under it.

There may be more to add to the blog in the next few days.

Normally we do post our intention to be on site on the blog and on the Forum, so that interested folk can come and see what we're up to! If anyone is interested in visiting they can also drop me a line. Unfortunately there are currently no opportunities to join us at Plugstreet as a volunteer, as we have a full team and reserves!

Other than No Man's Land there is The Great War Archaeology Group (GWAG) who are doing interesting things in Jordan, which has the advantage of blue skies and semi-permanent sunshine. However they are also activ in the Lincoln area, working on tank-related sites, and around London on a project looking at remains of the air war.

And, as a shameless plug, "Unearthing Plugstreet" by myself and Richard Osgood will be out in the summer. It will tell the tale of our work on Salisbury Plain, in Belgium and on the Australians who were there in 1917.

Best

Martin

Martin, after viewing your site, you are a very dedicated group and you do some outstanding work.

Martin,
Look forward to your book coming out.

Mick

Martin, do you have a website for the GWAG?

Follow the link...

http://www.gwag.org/

regards, Tom

If you are interested in TE Lawrence etc. then the Great Arab Revolt Project is the dig to visit. I have seen Neil Faulkner speak about it - fascinating stuff - which sheds a lot of new light on that campaign.

Martin

I've been following the Plugstreet blog for some time, so I very pleased to see that you will be bringing out a book soon.


Charles
Thanks for the Great Arab Revolt link. It certainly looks like a very interesting project.

Regards

Chris

This is the current situation with regards to De Diggers, this is from an article which appeared in the Western and Somerset Mercury on 8th April 2009. De Diggers are awaiting a change in the Law.


Article printed in The Western and Somerset Mercury on 8th April 2009

Soldiers' remains being bulldozed?
03 April 2009

THE remains of Somerset soldiers are at risk of being destroyed in former Belgian battlefields according to an archaeological group. Until last month a group called The Diggers were conducting surveys in the fields around Ypres, where many members of the Somerset Light Infantry were killed. But changes to Belgian law mean the group have been banned from carrying out the work and they are worried ground is being cleared without care being taken. Frans Hoijtink, a member of The Diggers who lives next door to the Essex Farm Cemetery, one of the biggest in Belgium, says he is 'absolutely disgusted' by what is happening. He added: "The town officials stand at the gates of the cemetery with wreaths in their hands while they know that this happens. "If we don't get into the building sites before work begins the bones just get bulldozed away." The Somerset Light Infantry fought in the fields around here and one field away from where they are currently building we found two soldiers who served with them."
The group had been salvaging bones from building sites for 25 years.
But following a dispute with politicians and archaeologists they were told their services were no longer required. Building work is taking place at the New Ypres Industrial Estate, the site that the group is worried about. However, the town's first deputy Frans Ligniel insisted there was no risk of any bones being destroyed He said: "It will never happen that bulldozers will work on places where there are bones and if they are going in the ground and finding remains work will be stopped.
"We asked the government if The Diggers are not allowed to clear the fields any more then who will do it?" Mr Ligniel was recently quoted in the Belgian newspaper Het Laatste Nieuws as saying he had asked the regional governor to review the situation and he hoped 'nothing serious' happened in the meantime.

As the other thread was closed and quite rightly so, I have posted the article. I have spoken to Frans this evening and hopefully this will allay any speculation on the De Diggers activities.


John

It seems the Diggers fears are unfounded , that must be a good thing

Martin,
have spoken to andy about this, is there any chance of being put in touch with the other relatives of the missing soldiers from the 1/kings Own that visit the grave at serre? Andy said he would but i think he got lost with other projects!
thanks
matt

"However, the town's first deputy Frans Ligniel insisted there was no risk of any bones being destroyed He said: "It will never happen that bulldozers will work on places where there are bones and if they are going in the ground and finding remains work will be stopped."

Very comforting. We hear rumours that Belgium Telecom and other major utilities are telling their staff to hide the bones and continue their work. Further, it is said that any worker who "opens their mouth" gets the sack. Sorry Frans, your assurrance does nothing for me. SEND IN THE DIGGERS, them, we can trust.

Peter

Not comforting at all. Think of how much damage using a shovel will do!
Another example. In the 80's I've done a story about DOVO, the bomb disposal unit. Great men, who did (and do) a great and dangerous job (one man was killed by a gas-shell shortly after my visit).
In Zonnebeke, close to the Bremen Redoubt, we passed a spot where roadworkers had just found two shells. Both were taken away. One of the DOVO-men told me about another discovery at nearly the same spot, when the road (Zonnebeke-Ypres) was widened, a few years before. Not one shell surfaced, not two, but whole loads. When DOVO arrived it became clear the roadworkers had discovered a large pile of shells. Because the shells had not been fired, the danger wasn't considered very high. The builder had a choice: having the shells removed by DOVO, which would cause a lenghthy (=expensive) interruption of the roadworks, or simply forget about the whole thing and carry on with the works.
According to the DOVO-employee I spoke the shells are still there.

Roel

Peter

Can you tell us where you heard this.

John

I suspect it'll prove hard to track this one back. Always difficult when rumours are heard and "it is said" something might happen. Best to treat with a pinch of salt unless/until some hard evidence turns up.

John

John,

Don't want to mention any names but it would be pretty close to "hearing it from the horses mouth". The person is a local, and very well situated to know what was going on, he lives close to Polygon Wood.

I feel that it should be against the law. ALL human remains should be reported to the appropriate authority, NO EXCEPTION. Heavy penalties should apply to the Corporate Entity...but then, even "whistleblowers legislation" doesn't help when you been sacked or your employer despises you, and funny, no one else will employ you either. Seems the word gets around rather fast.

Peter. Grrrrrrrrr!!!!

Peter
I totally agree with you.

John

'
When it is said " when we find bones, work will be stopped" and the archaeologists are outed, thats the time to start worrying. Most of the time, it will never happen. The people who are hired, just shovel away, and by some strange coincidence, never finds squat.

Hope it gets straightened before it's too late.
/Lars

Hello Matt

I don't have the details you might want, I suspect you need to remind Andy. He won't mind as he's always busy.

By the way, do you want copies of my two articles on Serre and the bodies for your article for the WFA?

Best

Martin

Well here's my tuppence worth.

I have at least on six occasions this year already, witnessed JCB's and work parties themselves destroy soldiers remains. On two occasions I have even jumped up onto the JCB and told the operator that his bucket had human remains in it. The response: What bones? Where? Hanging out of another JCB bucket was a sniper shield and human ribs etc.

The recent JCB dig to the rear of Bayernwald scattered many human remains and if I had a euro for every bone I see whilst walking my dog around the Boesinge Industrial site, then I would be able to retire!

Working litterally and living amongst these battlefields you see many things that visitors can miss, why? Because it is constant so not every one sees these things!

Frans raises a very interesting question. The towns ruling officials present a wreath one moment and the next moment permission is granted to destroy a battlefield for ever! Here is the on going problem. Progress without the emotional connection and dare I say it Patriotic connection and the euro/progression will win every time!

I have attended officially at least 32 soldiers burials around the town of Ieper today since September last year. No doubt I will attend many more but look at the figures involved? Over 100,000 British Empire troops missing and God knows how many French & German and no wonder when the workmen dig, up come the dead.

Is there an answer? My heart tells me one thing but my head tells me another thing. I have today walked from Farm 14 to Colne Valley CWGC. I saw loads of French cartridges falling from a JCB bucket, along with yes you've guessed it, several ribs and a human femur. This is the real world today and that my friends is the simple fact of the matter. The best we can hope for is the odd soldier recovered and brought in from the cold as many of you state but in reality as Frans states, dust to dust, ashes to ashes for progress!

This subject will run and run no doubt!

Dear All

No Man's Land will be out at Factory Farm again during the first week of August. The blog should be up and running to keep everyone updated.

Plugstreet Project

If you would like to visit drop us a line, if you can. While we do try to welcome interested parties there are times when it can be a bit busy - like last year when the body was being excavated - and you might not get the full tour!

Meanwhile, "Unearthing Plugstreet" by my good self and Richard Osgood will be out in August, published by Haynes.

Martin's book is available on pre-order from Amazon - use the GWF link Amazon so the Forum benefits!

Brian