My Grandfather (at the time Lt. EJ Howells) was an Infantry Lt when he left Australia (with the 23d) and records show he went to Lemos soon after being landed at ANZAC cove, then returned to ANZAC, was then sent to hospital. Records of the 23d do not mention him being wounded or dropped from the daily report - so I have been seeking which unit he was assigned or serving with when wounded.

More info today from a diary that named a man, a Cpl. JE Precious, who was cited for carrying my grandfather out of a tunnel in which they had set off an explosive charge on Russel's Top. Both men overcome by 'gas'. The diary names the "5th Field Coy." and October.

I don't know what 'coy' signifies, but as grandfather was an engineer by trade and training (and later commanded a bridging train in the Sini as an engineer) I assume this was an engineering unit charged with tunnels, mines, and such.

I have read in other threads that mining became a new art on the Western Front and wonder if that trade/skill was developed by new units at Gallipoli - and those with such talants taken from other units to make up new units. And if that had been done before or after the landings at ANZAC. (Which could lead me to exactly when my grandfather was landed at ANZAC.)

Any other info on this unit would help.

Thanks - Rod


"In some reports, references are made to a number of Australians who were "gassed" on the peninsular. These, however, were men who were injured by the poisonous gases following the explosion of some of our own mines. If a mine, when fired, did not break through satisfactorily to the open air or to the enemy's workings, the poisonous gas left by the explosion remained in the tunnel, endangering the life of anyone who entered it. For example, on Oct. 29, in order to make sure that a working party might safely enter Tunnel C2, in which a mine had just been fired, Lieut. F. D. A. Bowra (or Perth) of the 4th Fld. Coy. went down the rope ladder in the shaft leading to it. He had warned Lieut. E. T. Bazeley (of Nagambie, Vic.) of the 22nd Bn. that there might be danger from poisonous gases, and as he did not return Bazeley and a man named Currington (of Annandale, N.S.W.) went down with a rope. They found Bowra collapsed, but before they could rescue him both were overcome. Bazeley had barely strength to climb the ladder; Currington began to climb and fell back. Maj. Newcombe and Lieut. Thom were summoned from the 4th Coy.'s H.Q., and Thom, refusing to be tied to the rope, went down, but collapsed before he could save Bowra. The gas was now coming up the shaft. Cpls. J. A. Park (of Sydney), C. F. Mills (of Sydney), W. Bowden (of Geelong, Vic.), J. Shaw (of Kalgoorlie, W. Aust.), and others went down, but Thom, Bowra, Currington and two other men of the 22nd, Pte. W. B. S. Good (of Wonthaggi, Vic) and Pte. G. Stelling (of Essendon, Vic.) died, and Col. G. C. E. Elliott, chief engineer of the division, Maj. S. F. Newcombe, and twelve others were seriously "gassed." (Currington had five brothers serving at the war.). A similar accident had occurred shortly before in a mine-gallery at Russell's Top, where an officer of the 5th Field Coy., Lieut. E. J. Howells (of Camberwell, Vic), became unconscious, but was dragged out by Cpl. J. H. Precious (of Melbourne), who himself collapsed just as he reached safety. Both survived."

The Official History of Australia in the war of 1914 – 1918. The Story of Anzac. Volume 2. C. E. W. Bean. University of Queensland Press, page 823. (source 1)

Hi Rod

Your grandfather’s service record states he was transferred to the 5th Field Company Australian Engineers (from the 23rd Bn) on the 16/8/1915 at Heliopolis, Egypt – before embarking for Gallipoli on the 3/9/15.

The 4th & 5th Field Coy’s were raised at Heliopolis in early August 1915 (and also in Australia in the Sept). (2nd Division)
(The 1st, 2nd & 3rd were raised in Australia & sailed with the 1st Contingent)

Unfortunately the 5th FCE War Diary (on-line) starts with the unit raised in Australia – so doesn’t cover the other half of the unit’s time at Gallipoli.

However the 2nd Division HQ war diary (on-line) has a bit of info, including:

The Field Companies (4th & 5th) arrived at Anzac (from Lemnos) early on the 13/9/15.

Anzac
1/10/1915: Lt Howells E.J. proceeded to Lemnos for a rest, after being overcome by Mine Gas.
14/10/1915: Lt Howells returned to duty.
20/10/1915: Lt Howells E.J. evacuated with Neurasthenia


His accident is also mentioned in “The Royal Australian Engineers 1902-1919”.
p.46
“The 5th Field Company on 16 September took over from the New Zealand Engineers the mines in the sector north of German Officer’s, the sections being placed at Russell’s Top, Pope’s, Quinn’s and Courtney’s.
…………………….
“Working on the tunnels at this time were 15 men of the 5th Field Company and 26 miners from the infantry, ……………….
“This company nearly lost an officer from carbon monoxide poisoning late in October (sic) when Lieutenant E.J. Howells lost consciousness in a mine gallery: he was dragged out by Corporal J.H. Precious, who also collapsed as he neared safety, but survived.”


Hope this helps a little
Cheers, Frev

Wow Frev! Good info and from sources I had not found. The service records I have from the AWM are handwritten and I could not locate your reference to the assignment from the 23d Inf. to the 5th Field Coy. (I now know that Coy. is Oz short for Company) engineers.

Could you please give me the AWM or othe sites for the info you stated so I can add them to my files? I am already shopping for McNicoll's book as I was told there are several references to my grandfather - most would be from the Sini where he commanded a bridging company and got an MC.

So I can, using your data, state that he arrived at ANZAC cove on the 13th of Sept, was evacuated to Limnos on the first of Oct, returned to ANZAC on the 14th of October and then evacuated again on the 20th of Oct? Meaning he only made it for a couple of weeks total time.

As he was a 33 year old patent inspector riding a Melbourne desk only a few months before - it is a wonder how he lasted that long. I was 20 when I became a Infantry Lt and have been to see ANZAC cove and the battlefield. I don't know how long I would have made it at 20, much less at 33.

I searched the AWM awards site and found where Corporal J.H. Precious was written up for saving my grandfather. Still trying to find more on him as he may have a decendent whos hand I should shake.

Thanks - Rod

Have you looked at the records:
John Henry Precious 4431

http://www.naa.gov.au/collection/recordsearch/index.aspx

He was born in Ashford, England and his next of kin was father, in England. He may have relatives here.

Regards
CGM

Edited to add I see he had a wife in Australia, so there maybe descendants there.

(Judging by the next of kin his brother's records are on record too.)

Useful Aussie sites.

http://www.awm.gov.au/collection/war_diari...irst_world_war/

http://www.awm.gov.au/database/record_search.asp

http://www.awm.gov.au/histories/first_world_war/

http://www.awm.gov.au/units/ww1.asp

http://www.awm.gov.au/research/people/

http://www.awm.gov.au/research/people/roll_of_honour/

http://www.awm.gov.au/research/people/nominal_rolls/

http://www.awm.gov.au/research/people/wounded_and_missing/

http://cas.awm.gov.au/PROD/cst.acct_master...r&bos=Win32

Cheers
Kim

Hi again Rod,

The link to the service records of your grandfather (E.J.): http://naa12.naa.gov.au/scripts/imagine.as...mp;I=1&SE=1
Reading between a lot of the scrawl there are various references to E.J.’s transfer throughout his records, but it is clearly marked on page 40.

Direct link to the 2nd Div HQ War Diary: http://www.awm.gov.au/collection/war_diari...sp?levelID=1641

Yes, McNicoll’s book has references to E.J. in Palestine & Syria. The book would be well worth obtaining, but if you don’t have any luck, let me know & I’ll see what I can do about scanning the relevant pages for you.


A more direct link to the service records of John Henry Precious: http://naa12.naa.gov.au/scripts/imagine.as...mp;I=1&SE=1

Link to his brother William’s records: http://naa12.naa.gov.au/scripts/imagine.as...mp;I=1&SE=1

The Precious brothers enlisted together, but didn’t return home together, although they were both entitled to return early 1919 (1915 leave) – William had married in 1917 & so waited for a ‘brideship’, returning with his wife later that year.

John Henry married in 1922 & died in 1953 (age 64), his wife Alma died in 1978 – they are together in the Garden of Remembrance at Fawkner Cemetery, Melbourne.

William George died in 1977 & his wife Kathleen had died in 1975 – they too are at Fawkner Cemetery. (this couple lived in Preston & there is still a Precious living in Preston today - let me know if you'd like the details) [note: this doesn't seem to be a common name in Vic - so most likely related]

Cheers for now, Frev

Great work Frev - you are a treasury. I do have a copy of that page as it was part of my grandfather's papers I sent to the AWM before going to ANZAC for the dawn service. I wrote about that trip in a blog, should you be interested here is the page on that day:

http://rodsdispatchesmiddeeast.blogspot.co...p;max-results=1

What can you translate from the front of that 'application for commission' form (pg 39) The other units listed as 'previous service' are unknown to me. As I imagine it, he was recruited for the 2d Field Coy but went to Infantry officers training, then to Egypt with the 23d, and posted to the 5th Field Coy there. Is that how you read it?

As for McNicoll's book, having a problem finding just the 2d volume - set is pricy with shipping from Oz. Scanning the relevant pages for me would help a lot.

And special Kudos for the Precious bros. info. I will be doing some research in Melbourne this Oct. and will visit his grave for a thank you - and try to phone up a relative in Preston.

Again, thanks - Rod

Previous service:
Can’t be totally sure – but I read it that at some time pre-war he did a Recruits course with the 2nd Coy Engineers (Militia) & was a Lieut with the Senior Cadets (48th Bn). After war broke out, he enlisted in the AIF, completing Officer training whilst in camp at Broadmeadows – was alloted to the 23rd Bn and sailed as a 2nd Lieut with ‘B’ Coy on the A14 HMAT Euripides 10/5/1915, arriving at Alexandria on the 11th June – where they went into camp at Heliopolis.
He was then transferred to the 5th FCE on the 16th August (41 men from the 23rd had been transferred on the 12th).

[note: Having just realised that he was in B Coy, 23rd Bn – it’s very lucky that he was transferred out – because they were on the ill-fated Southland (with the 21st Bn) when it was torpedoed enroute to Gallipoli on the 2nd Sept – although not too many lives were actually lost luckily]


Awfully brave of you to attend the Anzac Day services at Gallipoli – I’m afraid the crowds would freak me out – the whole area is much more beautiful and peaceful – without the tourists!

Let me know an email address & I’ll send you the scanned pages from The R.A.E.

Cheers, Frev

Thanks for the translation, Frev. It is becoming clear now just where and when my granddad got to ANZAC Cove - and some of what happened after he left. Even his later roll in the early RAAF as those docs are being digitized and some new photos have turned up from family stashes.

As for the Southland saga, I did think he might have been aboard her or the other ship from which the photos of the Southland going down were taken (as only some of the 23d headquarters units were on the Southland). As I remember from my research trying to follow the 23d - only the CG (or as you say the GC) and his CSM were lost when the stokers crew from the boiler room piled into one lifeboat putting the brass into the drink. That put the 23d into combat with both posts filled with new people - not the best.

As for those scans - RodsDispatches@aol.com

I went to Gallipoli the first time, years back with just my wife - as part of a long around-the-world trip. You are correct - peaceful and reflective - but I needed to know more. By joining the AWM's offical tour for the Dawn Service, we were 'insiders' for a week before the day - stomping the battlefield with Ashley Ekins, the AWM's chief historian, and his counterparts from Turkey. As I wrote at the time, "... a privilege of knowledge." I too am no fan of crowds but the atmosphere makes the difference and the 'vibe' for ANZAC Day there was all good - both visitors and Turks. Did you read my blog from the trip? The 'Book' link has some photos you might enjoy both from ANZAC and the Jordan River bridge part of Granddad's story:
http://rodsdispatchesbook.blogspot.com/
Just click on the page/photo to see it full size.

Again, thanks for your skill and kindness. Can't wait to read from your scans. - Rod

Rod - I'll probably send the scans through in a couple of lots - don't want to crash your system!

Did you check the 2nd Div HQ Eng's War Diary (link in earlier post) - it says that the 4th & 5th FCE embarked on the Knight Templar & the Minnewaska on the 4th Sept, and sailed the next morning. Minnewaska arriving Lemnos on the 7th & Knight Templar on the 8th.
[I have identified 32 troops (incl. Col. Linton) + 10 crew lost in the Southland saga]

Thanks for the links to your blogs - I will get around to having a look.
I was also lucky to be amongst a select few knowledgable Aussies & Turks, and holding our own small dawn service at the Nek on the 7th Aug made up in part for having avoided Anzac Day.

Glad to see your research is going so well.
Cheers, Frev