Just watched an old Sherlock Holmes movie on TV and it occurred to me that most of the British stars of the 30s served during WW1. I know that Rathbone and Bruce did - Basil was gassed and Nigel machine-gunned (they pulled 11 bullets out of his legs).

Does anyone know who else served, what they did and what happened to their medals (i.e. are they on show anywhere). Also how many stars of the early screen met their end during WW1? I am sure many must have fought in WW1 as David Niven did in WW2.

I'm sure a similar topic has been raised before but not being clever enough I cant remember how to search for it, I'm sure another pal will know. I remember two or three of the "Dads Army" characters being mentioned, the actors who played Fraser, Sgt Wilson and Godfrey I think.

The thread was called Charles Laughton. Phil B

I think John Le Mesurier was in a cavalry/tank regiment in WW2 and served in India: he was seemingly only in his late-fifties/early sixties during the filming and thus far too young to have served in WW1, but would have been in his late-20s/30s during WW2. Clive Dunn was younger (only now in his 80s) and was captured (at Dunkirk?) and spent most of the War in a POW camp.

John Laurie, who played Fraser, served in France in 1917-18, I think in an infantry regiment.

I suppose very few film stars - if any - were killed in WW1 since the science was in its infancy in the pre-War years (omitting those real soldiers who starred as themselves in propaganda/anti-war films in the last years of the War); and since Hollywood predominated in this field and the US call-up was so much less widespread (and desperate) than in Europe, this is not too surprising. However, many of the film stars of the 1920s -30s must have seen service.

I suppose Charlie Chaplin and Stan Laurel didn't want to return to UK during the War in case they were called-up for service.

Richard

I remember this thread from before too:

Private Fraser - was in the H.A.C. Infantry and if I recal he was invalided out due to sickness or TB or something like that.

Private Godfrey - Arnold Ridley, who if I recall also wrote the play "The Ghost Train" (though I may be wrong) won the MM - the online MIC's show one William Arnold Ridley who was with the Som L I

Sorry for the scraps......

Michael Caine{Maurice Micklewight} was in Korea~ Not a Lot of People know that!

Priv,

I think you're right about the MM. In one episode Mainwaring saw a photo of Godfrey wearing it...... from what I've read (can't remember where - probably the "official" BBC Dad's Army site) that it was Ridleys own photo.

Les.

I'm not sure what Stan Laurel was up to during WW1 but he may have been too young? Most of the British character actors that fill out the films of the 1930s served though...

In the Adventures Of Robin Hood, you have Basil Rathbone, Donald Crisp, Herbert Mundin who all served. I wonder where there medals ended up given all the estate sales in the 60s and 70s before memoraqbili became such big business.

I think Stan Laurel was born 1889/90, so he would have been the perfect age for a New Army recruit; Chaplin was born a year or so earlier.

However, one cannot (with hindsight and modern values) blame either for not doing so - and no doubt they were of far more value, Chaplin especially during this period, working on the Home Front. In fact, had either taken American citizenship by this stage (or ever)?

Richard

Basil Rathbone was a officer in the 10th Battalion the King's Liverpool Regiment The Liverpool Scottish. I think?

Clive Dunn was captured in Greece. He ended the war as a p-o-w on a farm in Austria.

Both Stan Laurel & Charlie Chaplin were in the states during WWI................. Arthur Stanley Jefferson (didn't use the name Stan Laurel until 1918) went to the USA in 1910 as part of the Fred Karno troupe with a certain Charles Spencer Chaplin who co-incidentally he had understudied for in England. Stan left the troupe in 1916 but stayed in the states working with Alice & Baldwin Cooke. He got a contract with Universal Studies in 1917 & met Oliver Hardy a couple of years later. The rest as they say is history.

Charlie Chaplin as I already mentioned also went to the US in 1910 with the Fred Karno troupe. By 1913 he is contracted to Keystone Studios (makers of the Keystone Cops films) & was heavily involved in the US film industry whilst the Great War was being fought.........................See I did learn something from my schooling in Ulverston, the birth place of Stan Laurel .............incidentally when I left home at the tender age of 18 my first bachelor pad flat was a 1 room abomination smack bang above the Laurel & Hardy Museum.............I grew to hate that catchy little musical ditty which can be heard at the start of each one of their films...............The museum opened early on a Sunday morning & played that tune in a continuous loop to attract the punters........ I had usually only been in bed an hour or so after a hard night out on the tiles

http://myweb.lsbu.ac.uk/~stafflag/jimmyedwards.htmlnot WW1 but worthy of note all the same-

Royal Fusiliers no less.
And what not a lot of other people know is that he trained with no less than the Krays.

Ronald Coleman's attestation paper is used in that well known book on researching the soldiers of WW1.

I can say for sure that Arnold Ridley, of Dad's Army fame , did not win the MM. I carried out research into Ridley, and others, who were to become famous in the entertainment world a few years ago for an article on a similar subject. Educated at Bristol University, and a pre-war schoolmaster, he enlisted in 1915. Severely wounded on the Somme in 1916 he was discharged the following year as the result of his wounds. In Oct 1939 he rejoined, serving on the PR staff in France with the BEF in the rank of Major.

Terry Reeves

Unfortunately it would appear that a storyline in one of the episodes has transposed itself into an urban myth - a brave man nonetheless.

The episode concerning Godfrey's MM involved him being accused of cowadice and/or being a contientious objector by a member of a rival platoon. The rest of his own platoon took objection to him until it transpired he had served as a stretcher bearer and won the MM.....I think

Ian: Did the Krays go to Korea as well?

Also, I heard Oliver Reed was in Korea too....

Kevin

I think the Krays spent much of their National Service (2 yrs) in a Military Prison and therefore never left the UK.

Michael Caine took part in several engagements in Korea, where I believe he was a machine gunner.

Oliver Reed was in the RAMC and served with BOAR in Germany: he may have served in Korea, but I don't think so.

Roger Moore did his national service in the Intelligence Corps and Sean Connery joined the Royal Navy in 1946/7, but only served a year or so before being discharged after having been diagnosed with a duodenal ulcer.

Richard

"Thy Name is Trivia"

The Tower of London no less (briefly anyway)

doogal

I did actually say training - I know they did their basic together cos they also did it with my old Drill Instructor

I don't know how long he was in the army, but would Billy Bragg have qualified for a service medal?

doogal

David Niven--Will Smith--Audey Murphy--there are hundreds, i saw that Marlene Dietrich was supposed to be a spy dont know if that was true. I know that John Wayne never served.

Not a movie star himself but the father of David Niven is buried on Gallipoli.

CSM - Northern Ireland &/or UN Cyprus I suspect - he left pre 1982 as I first saw a gig of his then.

Dare i say George Bush-------------senior of course a navy pilot not a star i know, then theres his son, a great comedian and is rumered to have done some kind of service, somewhere, sometime, in some army i think

George Bush Snr was a US Navy Pilot in WW2 and fought against the Japanese and I believe was decorated. He was also head of the CIA in the 1960s during the Vietnam War.

Is it true Ian as my dad always told me in his films, that Audey Murphy was the most decorated or highly decorated man of WW2 ?????

I believe he was the most decorated US infantryman.

Arnold Ridley also played (at fly half?) rugby for bath, but his career was ended by his injury. Interesting to speculate how he got back in to the army for WW2.

Adrian
(OK, it's completely irrelevant to medals, but it fits in with Arnold Ridley)

NIGEL:

As Ian said, Murphy was the most decorated U.S. combat soldier of WWII.

Audie Murphy's Military Award List
Military Service Number 01 692 509

Medal of Honor
Distinguished Service Cross
Silver Star with First Oak Leaf Cluster
Legion of Merit
Bronze Star Medal with "V" Device and First Oak Leaf Cluster
Purple Heart with Second Oak Leaf Cluster
U.S. Army Outstanding Civilian Service Medal
Good Conduct Medal
Distinguished Unit Emblem with First Oak Leaf Cluster
American Campaign Medal
European-African-Middle Eastern Campaign Medal with One Silver Star, Four Bronze Service Stars (representing nine campaigns) and one Bronze Arrowhead (representing assault landing at Sicily and Southern France)
World War II Victory Medal
Army of Occupation Medal with Germany Clasp
Armed Forces Reserve Medal
Combat Infantry Badge
Marksman Badge with Rifle Bar
Expert Badge with Bayonet Bar
French Fourragere in Colors of the Croix de Guerre
French Legion of Honor, Grade of Chevalier
French Croix de Guerre With Silver Star
French Croix de Guerre with Palm
Medal of Liberated France
Belgian Croix de Guerre 1940 Palm

Chris

Can you imagine carrying that weight on you chest

For this years D-Day celebrations I bought a special issue of the movie The Longest Day. David Selznick, the Director of the Longest Day, was one of the most famous Hollywood Directors, and owned one of the major movie studios during the golden age of Hollywood. It turns out he was a very young teenager who served in WW1 and was subsequently influenced by his own experiences to honour the D-Day landings with the movie The Longest Day.

On the video there is a very moving scene at the end of some special footage where Selznick visits the WW2 American cemeteries near Omaha beach and reflects on the fact that "he had hoped that man would have learned about the futility of war after WW2, but sadly then went on to reflect that this was not the case since we had Korea, Vietnam etc etc." Says it all really. We can now add Iraq etc the list goes on.

There is that famous line in the The Furies beautiful song "The Green fields of France"... about a young soldier Willie McBride (buried in Authuille Cemetery down on the River Ancre "Did you really believe that this war would end wars".)

Back to the movie stars. James Stewart of course was on the bombers during WW2.

Kevin.

Movie Stars at war...

Richard Todd -served with the Parachute Regiment, D-Day drop with 6th Airborne Division and some post-war service in Palestine.

David Niven -pre-war HLI, then Commandos and Phantom (Recon) Regiment.

Charles Durning (US actor, usually plays heavyweight cops in "The Sting" and "Dog Day Afternoon") -US Ranger with D-Day service (Pont Du Hoc?).

Basil Rathbone -Liverpool Scottish, as already mentioned, but also awarded MC for a trench raid.

Hardy Kruger -under-age panzergrenadier towards the end of WWII.

Bernard Cribbens (of "Wombles" fame) -Parachute Regiment, Palestine in the late '40s.

Lee Marvin, actor -USMC 1941-45 including the Pacific "Island-hopping" campaign. Decorated and wounded (shell splinters in the backside and sciatic nerve).

Gene Hackman -USMC, 1950s.

Dennis Frantz ("NYPD Blue") -Infantry, Vietnam.

Oliver Stone, director -23rd Infantry Division, Vietnam.

Christopher Lee -RAF in WWII, also attached to various Special Forces.

...and some other famous ex-servicemen:

The German architect who invented the "Bauhaus" style served as an infantryman on the Western Front in WWI.

Bert Trautman, goalkeeper for Man City, 1950s -German Paratrooper throughout WWI, including Arnhem and the Ardennes. Famously played with a fractured neck-bone during a cup final -tough boys, those Fallschirmjager....

Compton MacKenzie, creator of "Monarch of the Glen" -served as an Intelligence Officer at Gallipoli and later ended up in court after writing his post-war memoirs.

Erskine Childers, writer of pre-WWI invasion scare novel "The Riddle of the Sands" -Boer War service with the CIV, later IRA gun-runner, subsequently executed.

Eric Newby, travel writer -SBS in WWII.

Paddy Leigh Fermor, writer and traveller -SAS and other Special Forces, WWII.

Charles Wheeler, political correspondant for "Newsnight" -Royal Marines, WWII including D-Day.

Wifred Theissinger, explorer -SAS and other Special Forces, WWII.

Michael Asher, explorer and writer -Parachute Regiment, 23 SAS and RUC, 1970s.

Rannulph Fiennes, explorer -Scots Guards(?) and 21 SAS, 1960s and 70s.

Frank Carson, comedian -Parachute Regiment, 1950s including active service against EOKA.

R.C. Sherriff, author of "Journey's End" -served in WWI with 9/East Surrey's. When the play was first performed, starring an unknown young actor named Laurence Olivier, costumes were in such short supply that Olivier wore Sherriffs old uniform with an MC ribbon added.

H.H Munro ("Saki"), author -KIA on the Western Front in WWI.

George MacDonald Fraser, author of the "Flashman" novels -service in Burma with the Border Regiment, later comissioned into the HLI, serving in Palestine.

...and to end with an Urban Myth (possibly, maybe someone here can confirm or deny this one...) John Denver, a qualified sniper during Vietnam War service...?

Hope this has been of some interest, all the best

Paul.

Clark Gable (Capt, final rank Major)

USAF based at Polebrook with the 351st

regards
Steve

Again not WW1 but Richard Todd served in the Parachute Regiment in Normandy and went on to play the part of Major John Howard, whose company of the Ox & Bucks took "Pegasus" Bridge in "The Longest Day".
Lee Marvin fought with the USMC in the Pacific - apparently him and is buddies booed John Wayne when he came to entertain them wearing combat fatigues and a pistol! What a poseur!!
Kenneth Woolstenholme - football commentator - "They think it's all over..." etc. was a Mosquito pilot.
I was in the Army and in a school play

Private Godfrey won the George Cross in the Dads Army episode

regards

Steve

Written by a Scotsman and adopted Australian - Eric Bogle.

Green Fields Of France - Eric Bogle

Well, how do you do, Private William McBride,
Do you mind if I sit down here by your graveside?
And rest for awhile in the warm summer sun,
I've been walking all day, and I'm nearly done.
And I see by your gravestone you were only 19
When you joined the glorious fallen in 1916,
Well, I hope you died quick and I hope you died clean
Or, Willie McBride, was it slow and obscene?

Did they Beat the drum slowly, did the play the pipes lowly?
Did the rifles fir o'er you as they lowered you down?
Did the bugles sound The Last Post in chorus?
Did the pipes play the Flowers of the Forest?

And did you leave a wife or a sweetheart behind
In some loyal heart is your memory enshrined?
And, though you died back in 1916,
To that loyal heart are you forever 19?
Or are you a stranger without even a name,
Forever enshrined behind some glass pane,
In an old photograph, torn and tattered and stained,
And fading to yellow in a brown leather frame?

The sun's shining down on these green fields of France;
The warm wind blows gently, and the red poppies dance.
The trenches have vanished long under the plow;
No gas and no barbed wire, no guns firing now.
But here in this graveyard that's still No Man's Land
The countless white crosses in mute witness stand
To man's blind indifference to his fellow man.
And a whole generation who were butchered and damned.

And I can't help but wonder, no Willie McBride,
Do all those who lie here know why they died?
Did you really believe them when they told you "The Cause?"
Did you really believe that this war would end wars?
Well the suffering, the sorrow, the glory, the shame
The killing, the dying, it was all done in vain,
For Willie McBride, it all happened again,
And again, and again, and again, and again.

There was the RN Lt Comd Harry Stoker, later an actor, who commanded the AE2 the first submarine to breach The Narrows.

http://www.awm.gov.au/people/1076732.asp

Chaps,
I seem to recall somewhere that Johnnie Weismuller the Tarzan actor served as a paratrooper WW2 - I know he was some sort of competition swimmer.
Or was it the Man City Keeper, Bert Trautman. A filmstar, no. Well, I saw him on the telly. I think a documentary showed him with the Iron Cross 1st class, in an old photo, with his diving eagle para wings (Luftwaffe type)
interesting discussion, by the way
Lee

There are two W McBrides in Authuille Cemetery. One is W McBride and the other is William.

Does anyone know which is the one mentioned in the poem?

thanks

Mike

I thought I'd add my tuppence worth on several replies and have thrown in a couple of new ones at the end

In no particular order.

George MacDonald Fraser served in the Gordon Highlanders in Libya post war not the HLI.

Roger Moore ended his service running an entertainment troop along with actor / director / writer and NCO Bryan Forbes

Pte Godfrey was an MM winner for rescuing wounded from no mans land in the First World War. The GC was a second world war medal.

Gene Hackman served in Korea in the USMC

Charles Wheeler (newsnight) ended WW2 with an Intelligence section hunting Nazis in Germany

I'd read that Michael Caine was sniper in Korea (Did he wear his own medals in the film 'The Whistle Blower'?)

Christopher Lee was in the SOE

Anthony Quayle was in the Royal Artillery in WW2 and spent some time as ADC to the Governor of Gibraltar and then spent some time helping the partisans in Albania (good background for his role in The Guns of Navarone). I don't know what medals he had.

Jack Hawkins won the MC as I've seen photos of him wearing it but I don't know what his war service was.

Cheers

Adam

Bit of a coincidence. Someone just sent me the following e-mail.

Real Hollywood Heroes

Alec Guinness (Star Wars) operated a British Royal Navy landing craft on D-Day.

James Doohan ("Scotty" on Star Trek) landed in Normandy with the U. S. Army on D-Day.

Donald Pleasance (The Great Escape) really was an R. A. F. pilot who was shot down, held prisoner and tortured by the Germans.

David Niven was a Sandhurst graduate and Lt. Colonel of the British Commandos in Normandy.

James Stewart Entered the Army Air Force as a private and worked his way to the rank of Colonel. During World War II, Stewart served as a bomber pilot, his service record crediting him with leading more than 20 missions over Germany, and taking part in hundreds of air strikes during his tour of duty. Stewart earned the Air Medal, the Distinguished Flying Cross, France's Croix de Guerre, and 7 Battle Stars during World War II. In peace time, Stewart continued to be an active member of the Air Force as a reservist, reaching the rank of Brigadier General before retiring in the late 1950s.

Clark Gable (Mega-Movie Star when war broke out) Although he was beyond the draft age at the time the U.S. entered WW II, Clark Gable enlisted as a private in the AAF on Aug. 12, 1942 at Los Angeles. He attended the Officers' Candidate School at Miami Beach, Fla. and graduated as a second lieutenant on Oct. 28, 1942. He then attended aerial gunnery school and in Feb. 1943 he was assigned to the 351st Bomb Group at Polebrook where flew operational missions over Europe in B-17s Capt. Gable returned to the U.S. in Oct. 1943 and was relieved from active duty as a major on Jun. 12, 1944 at his own request, since he was over-age for combat.

Charlton Heston was an Army Air Corps Sergeant in Kodiak.

Earnest Borgnine was a U. S. Navy Gunners Mate 1935-1945.

Charles Durning was a U. S. Army Ranger at Normandy earning a Silver Star and awarded the Purple Heart.


Charles Bronson was a tail gunner in the Army Air Corps, more specifically on B-29s in the 20th Air Force out of Guam, Tinian, and Saipan

George C Scott was a decorated U. S. Marine.

Eddie Albert (Green Acres TV) was awarded a Bronze Star for his heroic action as a U. S. Naval officer aiding Marines at the horrific battle on the island of Tarawa in the Pacific Nov. 1943.

Brian Keith served as a U.S. Marine rear gunner in several actions against the Japanese on Rabal in the Pacific.

Lee Marvin was a U.S. Marine on Saipan during the Marianas campaign when he was wounded earning the Purple Heart.

John Russell: In 1942, he enlisted in the Marine Corps where he received a battlefield commission and was wounded and highly decorated for valor at Guadalcanal.

Robert Ryan was a U. S. Marine who served with the O. S. S. in Yugoslavia..

Tyrone Power (an established movie star when Pearl Harbor was bombed) joined the U.S. Marines, was a pilot flying supplies into, and wounded Marines out of, Iwo Jima and Okinawa.

Audie Murphy, little 5'5" tall 110 pound guy from Texas who played cowboy parts? Most Decorated serviceman of WWII and earned: Medal of Honor, Distinguished Service Cross, 2 Silver Star Medals, Legion of Merit, 2 Bronze Star Medals with "V", 2 Purple Hearts, U.S. Army Outstanding Civilian Service Medal, Good Conduct Medal, 2 Distinguished Unit Emblems, American Campaign Medal, European-African-Middle Eastern Campaign Medal with One Silver Star, Four Bronze Service Stars (representing nine campaigns) and one Bronze Arrowhead (representing assault landing at Sicily and Southern France) World War II Victory Medal Army of Occupation Medal with Germany Clasp, Armed Forces Reserve Medal, Combat Infantry Badge, Marksman Badge with Rifle Bar, Expert Badge with Bayonet Bar, French Fourragere in Colors of the Croix de Guerre, French Legion of Honor, Grade of Chevalier, French Croix de Guerre With Silver Star, French Croix de Guerre with Palm, Medal of Liberated France, Belgian Croix de Guerre 1940 Palm.

Lt Col Niven was never in the Commandoes - 'tis a hoary old one....

When he returned to the UK to join the war effort he was determined not to return to HLI (too many bad memories there) so he was commissioned into the Rifle Brigade. He volunteered to join the GHQ Reconnaissance Regiment (or "Phantom") eventually commanding A Sqn (if my memory is correct).

By the time of Normandy he had been posted to SHAEF as a liaison officer and stayed there for the remainder of the war – he did not land on D-Day but arrived with the rest of SHAEF some months afterwards.

During his war service he was released to do film work periodically including "The Way Ahead" where he worked with Maj Eric Ambler and a certain Pte Peter Ustinov (who to allow him to be released for the film which he co-wrote was assigned as Niven's batman).

Cheers
Edward

More celebs:

Jimi Hendrix -served with 101st Airborne Division, early 60s.

Rueben "Hurricane" Carter, boxer -another "Screaming Eagle", late 50s.

Lewis Collins, "Professional" -10 (V) PARA, 1970s.

Nigel Benn, boxer -RRF.

Paddy Ashdown, politician -Royal Marines Commando and SBS, 1960s.

I thought James 'Scotty' Doohan was a gunner in the Canadian Army. Leslie Neilson was in the Canadian Army as well wasn't he?

In his autobiography David Niven writes that his intention was to join the RAF when he returned to the UK in 1939 but they turned their noses at him because he was an actor so he told them where to go and one of his pals got him a place in the Rifel Brigade.
I also read somewhere that he refused to be in any film with James Mason because Mason had been a conscientious objector during the war.

Alec Guiness was at the Rhine Crossing with his landing craft as well.

Have any of these been mentioned yet?

Ian Carmichael was in a Tank regiment I believe.

Peter Sellars was in the RAF. Harry Secombe and Spike Milligan Royal Artillery.

Humphrey Bogart was in the US Navy in WW1

I've put together a bit of research on Vernon Castle. Before WWI, Vernon and Irene Castle were a famous dancing couple - as famous at that time as Ginger Rogers and Fred Astaire became in the 1930s.

Vernon Castle had immigrated to the US from England before the war. He joined the RFC in Canada. He died in 1918 in a training accident. CVM Record

If anyone is interested in knowing more about him, send me a message and I have a number of WWI articles that I can forward to you.

I have the WW1 medal group to Richard Fisher, screen writer, author and correspondant,
I was also the training cpl for Lewis Collins when he joined 10 (V) Para, storys could be told!