Hi
Can anyone help me with some info regarding my grandfather Wilfred Lawton who served in a Field Ambulance unit during WW1? I have a copy of his medal card (which appears to be the only record that survived WW2) which notes under the "Roll" heading: R.A.M.C. 101B 31 (The "B" is in superscript)
I'm wondering if this is a Battalion/unit number? If not, does anyone have suggestions as to how I can find out which unit he served with?
Regards,
Andrew

Andrew

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but the reference R.A.M.C. 101B 31 is not a reference to his unit number but his individual entry in the Medal Roll. The reference can be translated (at the National Archives) into a WO329/xxxx reference which will be the actual Medal Roll with his entry listed.

The Medal Rolls often give additional information such as Battalion/unit details but I believe that this is not so with the RAMC, the ones I've seen merely state RAMC, no unit details.

Regards

Steve

If you post his service number someone might no which unit it belonged to.

Hi
Thanks for the help but I'm not sure I even have his service number. The only number I have is on the medal card under the heading "Reg'd number" & that is 81196. Do you know if this would be a service number?
Thanks for your help.
Andrew

Andrew, I hope you don't mind if I add my similar difficulties.
I understand that RAMC personnel were attached to fighting units. I am researching the 123 Coy MGC and I know that their RAMC complement comprised
Cpl Taylor
Pte Hamber
Pte Hamilton

no full names, no numbers !
There are 106 Hamiltons on MIC, 103 Taylors and 3 Hambers - but none survive in WO 363.

Am I right in assuming that I don't have a hope in h--l of finding these people !?
Surely there must once have been a list of where RAMC personnel were allocated.
Julian

Much the same situation for my grandfather the notation 101 B27 and a page number appears on his medal record , I was unbelievably lucky in that I chanced upon a photograph of him on a website. I have not been to Kew but if his service record still exists, 1 in 4 chance, it would presumably go in to far greater detail and list a parent unit.

Best of luck

Julian

This is a major problem we encounter daily in the AMS Museum. I have never found a complete list of which RAMC units and teeth arm units RAMC personnel were allocated to. The same goes for Regimental Medical Officers. I have started a database of doctors and the units they were allocated to but it will be a long job.

Pete Starling

Hi Andrew, Steve, elliot, Julian and John.

My late father was in the RAMC, he was a historian for over 20 years but never found a comprehensive list of all RAMC personnel who took part in the Great War. He did however, find many papers, journals and books that contained various lists. Some of the lists provide very detailed information, but unfortunately, some of the lists only give a name and regimental number, some give a name and Unit but no regimental number, and some just gave a name and rank. It is a nightmare to sort out but sometimes a soldier can appear on more than one list.

I have now taken over my Father's research and am putting together a database of all RAMC personnel from the information I have to try to collate it. Hopefully then at least one comprehensive list will exist, but as Peter Starling states 'it will be a long job'.

I have taken a note of the names you are researching and will check them against the lists that I have.

Barbara

bjay

could I ask you check the name William Milner on your ramc list too. Landed france 24/3/1915

thanks

Phil

Hi All
Thanks for the info I am managing to glean from all your posts. I'm very glad to see I am not the only person banging my head on the proverbial brick wall. I'm also wondering whether my grandfather's location would have related to his allocation. He was from Durham (born in Seaham Harbour) & presumably joined up there. I wondered if he would have automatically been attached to a Durham unit such as the Durham Light Infantry. Any thoughts/ideas?
Regards to all,
Andrew

Phil

No problem. I will also check to see which Units landed in France on that day but it's going to take me a couple of days due to work commitments.

Barbara

Hi Phil

The only RAMC Unit to arrive in France in 24/3/1915 is No 18 General Hospital. I have not got a list of any personnel attached to that Unit.

However, I have found three W Milners.

1638 Milner W 6th London Field Ambulance attached to 47th (2nd London) Division
Arrived in France on 16/3/1915
This name was on the Nominal Role as at August 1914. He was listed in B Section

401411 Pte Milner W 1st West Riding Field Ambulance attached to 49th West Riding Division (TF)
Arrived in France on 14/4/1915
This name was taken from the Leeds Absent Voters List

Capt Milner WA 1st South Western Mounted Brigade Field Ambulance
I couldn't find any reference to when or where they arrived.
This name was taken from an Officers List 1916

I hope the soldier you are searching for is listed here.

Barbara

Barbara

Thanks for the info. My grandfather is not one of the three men you mention. Before enlisting he was a 1st officer on merchant ships, so I don't know how he gets into the RAMC, but he got tranfered out of the RAMC in 1916 to the RNR and is then commissioned as a temp. Lieutenant, then later moves to the Royal Engineers waterways & railways division. A real mystery to try to solve, but I'm slowly building up information. I wonder if the connections RAMC and Navy background could be a hospital ship when he enlisted ?

Thanks anyway

Regards

Thanks for all your help.

Hi

I've check my lists for

Wilfred Lawton

Pte Hamber
Pte Hamilton
Cpl Taylor

but cannot find any reference. Sorry

BJay,

Here's another one I would appreciate your checking for.

I have been trying to research a Doctor who was assigned to the 9th Field Ambulance. Here is what I have found so far.....

Temp. Captain C(harles) F. Drew RAMC

19 March 1915- Appointed Temp Lieutenant --- L.G. 12 May 1915 (Supp)

1 June 1915 – Entered France --- Medal Index Card

19 March 1916 – Appointed Temp Captain --- L.G. 10 April 1916 (Supp)

24 Dec 1917 – Mentioned in Despatches (L.G. of same date? Pg.12484?)--- Medal Index Card

23 Jan 1918 –Relinquished commission on account of illness. – L.G. 22 Jan. 1918 (Supp)

1 Jan 1919- Awarded the Military Cross (No. 9, Field Amb) - L.G. 1 Jan. 1919 (Supp)

7 Nov 1924 ? Associated with Victory, British , Star (1915) & Emblems on MIC

Also shown as on Officer roll 141 Pgs. 204b and 338 .


No.9, Field Ambulance.
Joined 3rd Division Aug 1914
Left 3rd Division 28 Aug 1915
Joined Guards Division 28 Aug 1915
Duration?

I've been told that the records for Temporary Commissions were not kept, so his history has been difficult to ferret out. I tried to find him after the war, but don't really know where to start with civilian records.

Thank you in advance for any light you may be able to shed on this.

Dean

Hello Dean

DREW, Chas. Francis M.C., c/o National Bank of Australasia, 5 Bishopsgate, E.C.2 - M.B.,B.S. Adelaide 1911: Temp. Capt R.A.M.C.

I found this in the 1921 Medical Directory. If it is your man then he went on to become a Practicioner within the postal District of London.

I hope this helps. If not I'll try other lists.

Barbara

Barbara,
Thank you for the quick reply. I'm sure this is my man and it gets more and more interesting.
I'm going to have to borrow your expertise once again. The address you found is "care of" N.B. Australasia and there is a mention of Adelaide. (N.Z.?) Is there a chance that he had emigrated and this was his London contact point? I'm not good at translating Brit addresses.
The reason I have for asking this is I am researching him in connection with an inscribed revolver from WW1. I have traced the revolver's ownership back to 1947. At that time it was in the possession of a person (not Drew) in Australia. Due to the markings on the gun (or actually, the lack of certain markings), indicates that it was not commercially exported from England and was, more than likely, "hand carried" out of the British Isles.

If this is a possibility, I may have to start searching "Down Under".

Dean

added: I just reread the address and am wondering if the reference to "M.B.,B.S. Adelaide 1911" is when and where he received his medical schooling?

Dean

I am not an expert but I am guessing that he may have given that bank address because he may not have had a permanent address in England. However, he most likely did bank at that branch so used it as a postal address.

I would say that his medical training was definately in Adelaide, Australia? (I have not heard of Adelaide in NZ). Maybe he practiced both there and in London.

Barbara

Hi Barbara

Re: Wilfred Lawton
Thanks for your help anyway. I'm at a bit of a dead end with it it at the moment. Do you think the number 81196 off the medal card would have been his service number? Other than that I have absolutely no other info on him at all.
Regards,
Andrew

Hi Andrew

The number 81196 sounds to me like his Regimental Number. It should be under the heading Regtl. No on the Medal Card.

Sorry I can't help any further. I will post a message on here if I do ever managed to trace him. If you get any other information, let me know so we can try to narrow down the options.

Good luck

Barbara

Barbara

Could you please see if you have any record of my Grandfather, Pte Arthur Pitt in your records?
His regimental No on his MIC is 16.

Thanks
Bob

Hi Bob

I searched my lists but unforunately couldn't find any references to your Grandfather. Sorry.

Barbara

Barbara

Thank you for searching.

Regards
Bob

This is not realy related to this topic but I thought i would post the pictures any way they are of the 108th FA with the names of the men on back of card. The RSM with the Sam Brown has what i think is the 17th Div flash on his arm .

Dan

Dan

The images you have attached are of great interest to me.

Is it possible to enlarge them so that I can compare the names with any records I have?

Many thanks

Barbara

Barbara this 27th FA about Christmas time 1914 at Aldershot I believe, half of them don't have cap badges yet, fairly typicla of New Army Blokes. My Grandfather is front row 2nd in from right. The only other one I can ID is Pte Albert Chapman who is 2nd Back row on extreme left.

Click to view attachment

Straying off subject a bit but does anyone know the whereabouts of a RAMC training depot in Wales that was used in the Great War. i would be obliged if it rings bells with anyone.

Thanks for posting image John.

I've got a feeling that I may have seen this before. Will have to come back to you on that.

Barbara

Llandrindod Wells was a base of the RAMC and Noel Godfrey Chavasse was one of the officers in charge there, before he went overseas.

Will try i am having major probs with soft ware on me new com

Dan

Andrew you may well have this info by now, but this is the link to your Grandfathers Medal Index Card, may shed some more light.

Description Medal card of Lawton, Wilfred
Corps Regiment No Rank
Royal Army Medical Corps 81196 Private

Date 1914-1920
Catalogue reference WO 372/12

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documen...p;resultcount=1

John

You were asking about training depots in Wales.

I'm in the middle of researching snippets I've picked up from a Caernarfonshire newpaper called Herald Cymraeg.
On 12th January 1915 it refers to 16 men from the Deiniolen/Dinorwig area joining the RAMC and they went to Porthcawl ( in S Wales)

In June a number of them are reported home on leave from Prestatyn ( in North Wales). A quick google shows that there were three companies of the there in 1915.

Hope this helps

Hywyn

By the way BJAY
If you're monitoring this thread I think I can identfy them all by number but I need to get my head round how to present it if you're interested.

Hi Hywyn

That would be really great, I am definitely interested.

Many thanks

Barbara

Hi Barbara

I'll PM you within the week when I've had a proper look.


Hywyn

Hi,
I'm looking for any information about my grandfather, Hubert J Clark, who was a stretcher bearer in the RAMC. I've located his medal card but it gives little info apart from his regiment no: 77954. Apparently he was wounded, but we don't know when and where. He survived the war.
Regards Gamakly.
PS his surname would normally have had an 'e' on the end but as there was no 'e' on the medal card I have left it out here.

Saw your post and hope that maybe you will be able to help me, I am a real newbie to this part of family history. I have a photograph of my grandfather which clealy shows RAMC on his uniform. I know that this is the medical corps but other than that I know nothing, other than his name Edwin Scudamore.
Can you give me a few pointers on how to proceed in gaining information about him, maybe if I'm really lucky his name already appears somewhere within your research.

Thanks
Paul

Hi Paul

You can download his mic from here for £3-50.
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documen...p;resultcount=1

Medal card of Scudamore, Edwin C
Royal Army Medical Corps 444117 Private

regards

Phil

Hi Bjay

I`m really sorry to heap yet another name on to you to check. But I would be grateful if you could check out Samuel Whorton 81532 on you RAMC list. He was my Gt Grand,others step-brother. He died 24/12/18 and is buried at St James church in Norton Canes. Most of the rest of the family served in the South Staffs Reg if its any help.

Many thanks. Kev.

Phil
So I download this MIC but unclear what information this woul give me. Reading some of the earlier posts it sounds like RAMC information is a little scarce. My main interest is when he joined and where he served. I am also looking into my Wifes Grandfather who was in RFA. Would like to know if they fought in the same battles. I know this may sound a bit romatic but ...

Hi Gamakly

I have traced one Hubert Clarke as known to have served with 33 Field Ambulance. However, I do not have a service number listed so I cannot state that this is definately your Grandfather.

The 33rd Field Ambulance served in the 11th (Northern) Division and was located in Gallipoli before going to France. Does this ring any bells?

I will have a look through the info I have on 33 Field Ambulance to see if I can trace where this name has come from.

Barbara

Hi Paul (onthecauseway)

Milner has provided you with valuable information in that your Grandfather's service number was 444117. In 1917 Territorial Units were allocated a range of 6 digit numbers and all those serving in the Territorial Force were given new numbers to correspond with the Unit they served.

The numbers 444011 - 446000 was allocated to the 2nd Southern General Hospital. T. Your grandfather's service number 444117 means that he was serving with this hospital.

The 2nd Southern General Hospital. T covered the military hospitals in the Bristol area, however, a part of it was sent abroad.

The War Diary opened at Bristol 16th Feb 1917 "Can you form a hosptial from Southern GH for overseas (France)?".

It arrived in France on 22 April 1917 and was sited at Etaples from 23/5/1917 - 26/4/1919.

Your Grandfather's MIC will tell you what medals he was awared and the place and the date he first arrived abroad.

Hope this helps

Barbara

Hi Kev

So far, I have looked in Soldiers Died in the Great War, RAMC. but Samual Whorton is not listed in it. I did trace him in the RAMC Graves and Memorials book but it provides the same information as the info on the CWGC website.

I am now in the process of adding names to a database so if I find him on a Roll of Honour I will send you a PM.

I note that the cemetery is in Staffordshire, so you may find a reference to his death in a local archived paper or in the London Gazette. Also, the RAMC tried to place wounded soldiers into a hosptial as close to their home town as possible, if you are not aware of his home address it might be worth looking for him on a Staffordshire Absent Voters List. If you can trace him this way then you may be able to find out which Unit within the RAMC he served.

Good luck

Barbara

Hi Barbara, many thanks for taking the time and trouble to look this up for me, it is much appreciated. I will try some , well probably all, of your suggestions.
Thanks again.
Kev.

Hi Barbara,
Thanks for replying so quickly. I've spoken to my mother but she says Grandad never mentioned being in Gallipoli. She has a letter that he received while in training which was dated 2nd Feb 1915. I forgot to mention that when we found his medal card there was another one on the same page with the same name. I assumed that as we knew that Grandad was definitely in the RAMC that this man would be different. His service number is 18063 and the regiment ( I think) says RE. Do you think they may be the same person? They were both awarded the British and Victory medals. There is no other information on either of the medal cards as to when they joined the war.
I'm afraid I have no other info, except that Mum has an idea that he told her he was injured during the battle of the Somme.
Many regards Gamakly.

Barbara,

Thanks for checking the nominal rolls you have for 1st and 141st FA. I believe my grandfather did not join until 1915, but based on the medals he received I assume (if that date is correct) he did not get to France until 1916. I know less about his brother and when he joined.

I think it is most likely that my grandfather was with with the 1st into 1919 since the billeting location for the 1st matches his description while the 141st does not. As the 1st was stood down the men were distributed to the remaining FAs and apparently he went to the 141st where I see his SOS record.

I also notices that men are moved between units for TD quite a lot - more than I would have expected and I believe much more than would have happened between infantry units. Unless of course, you compare it to how much movement there was between Coys within a regiment. (I don't know the answer to that - after all as you know I'm air ;-) Perhaps someone else can comment?)

I have got the War Diary for the first month of the No 1 FA transcribed and in pdf. Its about 152K in size and a draft form that needs a little touching up, but is quite useable. I'm posting this here in case other on the forum are interested. The first OC writes more than some later ones so there is some record of his impressions as well as statistics. How can I get his to you? Is 152K to large for an attachment on this forum?

Cheers,

John Harrop

Gamakly

The name Hubert Clarke that I have serving in the 33rd Fld Amb was mentioned in the book Gallipoli by John Masefield, so if it is your grandfather then he definatley served in Gallopoli.

33 Fld Amb was located in Gallipoli between 6th Aug - 20th Dec 1915, they were then on the Somme between 14th Sep - 28th Sep 1916, then they moved to Ypres. If your Grandfather wasn't entitled to the 1914-1915 Star then it would be safe to say that this is not your grandfather.

It is possible for two MIC's to belong to the same person, maybe a look at the actual medal roll might provide you with more information.

Also, if you can find out where your grandfather's home address was during the war you may also be able to trace him on an absent voters list.

Good luck

Barbara

Hi John

Many thanks, I will send you a PM with my email address

Barbara

Hi Barbara. No idea if it helps but I have a note of Lieutenant R.J.Jones being killed by machine gun fire whilst out in No Mans Land tending the wounded. This occurred 10 July 1916 during the Welsh Division attack on Mametz Wood.

And Captain Jones (131 RAMC) asking for volunteers from the HQ staff to assist in bringing in the wounded and finding that every man voluntered including many who had been up all night dealing with the wounded from an attack on Morlancourt).

Bernard

Hello Bernard

I have T/Lt Raymond John Jones listed as KIA 10/7/16 under 129 Fld Amb. He is buried at Carnoy Military Cemetery, France. Same Division though - 38th.

I did not have an account of how he died so I can add that now. Excellent, thanks very much.

Barbara

Barbara,
Many thanks for the information. I'll follow that up to double check if Grandad really was at Gallipoli. You are very kind to search for all this information for us. A real star!
Regards
Gamakly