Jump to content
Great War Forum

Remembered Today:

4thGordons

German Uniform Photos

Recommended Posts

4thGordons

Another tunic (with braid etc) - So presumably (given context) some form or artillery dress tunic?

I (tentatively) think the piece in the background is a 10.5cm Feldhaubitze 98/09 (can someone confirm?)

post-14525-0-57260800-1419867881_thumb.j

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JWK

Looks like a Hussar.

There were 21 or so Hussar regiments.

(And is it me or does his right foot look a bit wonky ?)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4thGordons

Does look a bit odd (high heels?)

post-14525-0-00007000-1419870351_thumb.j

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
JWK

He probably moved his foot when the picture was taken, the horse looks like it moved his hindlegs.

What does the man have on his shoulder? Is that a Roman X ?

I've read somewhere that certain Hussar Regiments had Roman numerals for officers, and Latin ones for the rest.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Tony Barton

The thing on his stirrup is surely a butt for a lance.

Wonderful pics by the way. fascinating.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4thGordons

The thing on his stirrup is surely a butt for a lance.

Wonderful pics by the way. fascinating.

Ahhhh yes that makes sense - a cup in which the end of the lance could rest. Thank you.

Sorry JWK - the shoulder board is completely illegible.

Chris

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
shippingsteel

Re post #76

Chris, your cavalryman is wearing the Attila tunic of the Husaren. Luckily these units all wore different combinations of colours on their headwear (Mützen).

So looking at the photo I am going to go with a Dunkelblau top, a Red shade of capband and with White piping. Also appears to be the Prussian kokarden.

That narrows the unit down to being the Husaren-Regt. Landgraf Friedrich III von Hessen-Homburg (2.Kurhessisches) Nr.14 and from the XI Armee Korps.

And yes the 'wonky boot' is certainly a pole cup for either a lance or a flagpole. I must say the reference to the 'high heels' had me "rolling on floor laughing" :w00t:

Cheers, S>S

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4thGordons

How about this chap then? Not entirely sure it is military -- could be railway or.... given the collar. He appears to have just one cockard with some other badge/collar symbol.

post-14525-0-73369500-1419892285_thumb.j

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
shippingsteel

Not Imperial military ... he only wears the single Reich's Kokarde, which usually indicates they are part of a "Reich's asset" - so some kind of Administrative official.

Cheers, S>S

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
trajan

Nein, dummkopf.!

I was correcting your earlier information (which you always say you are so happy to receive?) :whistle: There is a slight difference in the way the Landsturm units were designated ...

Their titles were based on the town of origin, in this case it is the 2nd Bataillon Landsturm which emanated from Andernach, but the 5th Landsturm unit in the VIII Armee Korps.

Cheers, S>S

Thanks SS! Always happy to be corrected, but you can leave out the insult!

My only excuse in this case being - as explained several times - I was working in haste and with just my notes to guide me... So, for the benefit of others, now that I am back in the UK and have a chance to hook up the portable hard drive to the laptop, the start of the numbering system for the AK VIII was:

VIII.1 = 1.Landsturm-Infanterie Batallion (Aachen)

VIII.2 = 2.Landsturm-Infanterie Batallion (Aachen)

VIII.3 = 3.Landsturm-Infanterie Batallion (Aachen)

VIII.4 = 1.Landsturm-Infanterie Batallion (Andernach)

VIII.5 = 2.Landsturm-Infanterie Batallion (Andernach)

VIII.6 = 1.Landsturm-Infanterie Batallion (Bonn)

etc., etc. Larger places, like Aachen and Boon could have as many as 3 battalions; small places 1 or 2.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
trajan

It's a bit like archeology, isn't it?

We get fed all the clues, but without contemporary written evidence we're just left making an educated guess.

"Oh, we believe this was a temple where they worshipped the goddess of fire".

And up there someone is rolling on the floor laughing, and crying "Are they for real? That was my stóve!"

For, maybe a little, help with those Kokarden (the bottom one that is, the top one is always the Deutsches Reich one:

in b/w and colour

*edit: ah, they don't show completely in the post. Click on them and you get the full view.

No, that applies to prehistoric archaeology only...

Thanks for putting up the cockades though!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
trajan

Looks indeed to be a 1910 Uhlan tunic - but could be another cavalry? Off duty so no spurs, etc.! There are horizontal stripes on the collar, and so if he is Uhlan, my notes suggest he is 1, 2 or 3 Guards; or 17, 18, or 19. If not Uhlan, there are a variety of other cavalty units with those collar stripes. Don;'t have time to check the cockade - maybe SS will do that.

Is that an EK II ribbon?

Re post #51 (top)

Correct Chris, this guy wears the Ulanka ... the tunic associated with the Uhlans. His tunic also shows the Polish cuffs, so definitely a Prussian Ulanen Regiment.

Cheers, S>S

Well-spotted on those cuffs! Assuming that he is Prussian, and the cockade suggests he is, then if those are horizontal collar stripes then according to my notes (my books in Ankara) he is from one of the following:

Ulanen-Regiment Kaiser Alexander III von Rußland (Westpreußisches) Nr.1, or

Ulanen-Regiment von Katzler (Schlesisches) Nr.2 (if that counted as Prussian?), or

Ulanen-Regiment Kaiser Alexander II. von Rußland (1. Brandenburgisches) Nr.317.

The 17,18, and 19, also had horizontal collar stripes, but the first two were Saxon units and the last from Wurttemburg.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4thGordons

I scanned a few more overnight - both horse transport and both appear to have unit markings on them.

The first looks like a group of convalescent soldiers on a trip to the countryside - accompanied by a horse drawn medical transport.

post-14525-0-03221900-1419958098_thumb.j

post-14525-0-63852100-1419958097_thumb.j


The second looks like some form of fairly heavy cart. It too appears to have unit designation on the side

post-14525-0-75225900-1419958255_thumb.j

post-14525-0-34519400-1419958255_thumb.j

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4thGordons

The last looks to be some form of ration distribution?

Note civilian onlookers with bike!

post-14525-0-71014100-1419958548_thumb.j

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
trajan

Re your last photo (post #67)

This will be the Karpathenabzeichen decoration which was awarded to Bavarian units who fought with the Austrians (k.u.k) in that particular region.

Only approved in 1917, and only awarded to a couple of Bavarian Infanterie Divisions (ie. the Karpathenkorps). Note the paler contingent Kokarden.

There is a history of the Korps here: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karpathenkorps.

According this (if I have read it properly) the Korps was initially formed from the Prussian 1. Division (Konigsberg), comprised of:

1. Ostpreußische Grenadierregiment Nr. 1 "Kronprinz".

3. Grenadier-Regiment „König Friedrich Wilhelm I.“ (2. Ostpreußisches) Nr. 3,

43. Infanterie-Regiment „Herzog Karl von Mecklenburg-Strelitz“ (6. Ostpreußisches) Nr. 43.

To this Korps was added (in 1916) the 200 Division, which was formed around:

Jäger-Regiment Nr. 3,

plus various reserve Jäger units (all apparently from Prussia),

plus the newly-created

Jäger-Regiment Nr. 4 and

Jäger-Regiment Nr. 5.

SS, I can't find any reference in this German source to any Bavarian units as being attached to the Karpathenkorps, so as I am probably missing something here, as you seem certain there were - would you be so kind as to provide your source (without insult this time please :thumbsup: )?

As for the badge, then to fill out what SS has offered, I understand that the Karpathenkorps-Abzeichen was instituted on 7.4.1917 for those who served with the Korps for a minimum of 2 months

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cnock

post nr. 4 and 7

regards,

Cnock

post-7723-0-14175100-1419960481_thumb.jp

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4thGordons

post nr. 4 and 7

regards,

Cnock

Thanks very much - great to see!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4thGordons

Here are a few more - grouped simply because they use a vignette style of photograph and varying uniform styles

post-14525-0-25329500-1419960790_thumb.j post-14525-0-03459400-1419960791_thumb.j post-14525-0-72376900-1419960810_thumb.j

The medal ribbon(s?) on the first one appear to be different.

Chris

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
trajan

How about this group: All sporting the same medal ribbon and similar uniforms -- but what is the sleeve badge?

attachicon.gif86group.jpg

attachicon.gif86insig.jpg

Re your posts #63 & #64

I believe the sleeve insignia to which you refer indicates that this chap at front is a Doctor, but it might be worth getting some confirmation on that.?

My guess would be that they are all Medical Staff of some kind, given the very dark capbands. The Medical branch sported Dunkelblau capbands.

For ease of reference, the group photograph is:

post-69449-0-83350800-1419960804_thumb.j

The medal ribbons are for the EK - I would imagine EK I, as the EK II ribbon - as I understand it - was worn in the button hole (but see that post above by Dave.

I cannot comment from the notes I have on the apparent colour of the hat bands - maybe our Antipodean friend SS can offer a source reference to that?...BUT, the sleeve badge certainly looks to be the correct symbol for a medical officer - a single snake wrapped around an asklepian, and so the symbol of Asklepios, god of (inter alia) medicine

BTW, note that any medical 'professional' using a double snake wrapped a kērukeion or caduceus, is in principle NOT to be trusted! The kērukeion is the 'Herald's Staff' used by Mercury, who is the patron of, among others, liars, cheats and gamblers, and so this is the symbol of one or other of those... Quite why the US of A uses that symbol for its medical corps, as below, is beyond me...

post-69449-0-43089500-1419961410_thumb.j

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
trajan

Yes...so what is the equivalent of the old archeologist fallback "we believe it to be of ritual significance" :ph34r:

And then there are examples like this -- where they kindly hang a sign!

attachicon.gifSign.jpg

And about time.! Finally we get an easy one. I'm piling right in on this one while I've got the chance, haha.! :thumbsup:

So I think the sign says Schreibstube which should in this case mean Orderly Room, of the 2.M.G.K.J.R.91

So the Orderly Room of the 2nd Maschinengewehr Kompagnie of the (Oldenburgisches) Infanterie-Regiment Nr.91 :hypocrite:

Yes...so what is the equivalent of the old archeologist fallback "we believe it to be of ritual significance" - True ONLY of prehistoric archaeologists!

Now back to the real stuff... Again, I'll take a liberty and reproduce the photograph for ease of reference, otherwise we will all be wandering around like a Myrmecia pilosula looking for a quarry...

post-69449-0-59821200-1419963884_thumb.j

SS seems to be correct on the sign - easy-peasy... BUT, note that none of the men have a machine gunner's badge.

Also note that the seated man on the right has a single stripe on his cuff and lace on his collar, so I think he will be a Feldwebel. I don't know what his medal ribbon is, but I don't think it is an EK.

The seated man on the left may well be a Etatmässige Feldwebel - he has a lace collar and large buttons over his shoulders, and - think - an EK II ribbon (?). As I understand it, an Etatmässige Feldwebel would have two stripes on his cuffs - but he is wearing a 1915 transitional tunic, and so no fancy Brandenburg, etc., cuffs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
trajan

And here is yet another sort of jacket...with upper and lower pockets. The cap is different too (much heavier chin-strap evident) and a plainer belt. This is dated 1918. His shoulder tabs show what looks like a crown over 26

In the lower photo, it could perhaps be a French Horn over the 26, which would indicate a Jaeger unit (but I can't be sure so I'm only guessing here.?)

So possibly a member of Reserve-Jäger-Bataillon Nr.26 which were a wartime raised unit of Saxon origin, which would match with the light Kokarden.

Again, ease of reference for all others...

post-69449-0-75286300-1419964842_thumb.j

Can't help with the tunic - it might be a 'private' issue? I have seen something similar elsewhere described in that way - but the relevant book is in Ankara and I am in Oxford...

Yes, Kgl. Sächs. Reserve-Jäger-Bataillon Nr.26. Note also his NCO lace and large button, so - given his youth - perhaps an Unteroffizier

The buckle is - I think - non-standard: it is similar to the cavalry type but I don't know what type of buckle was usual for Jäger units.

Note also the loop of the troddel on the bayonet frog and that the scabbard seems to of leather.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
trajan

Another tunic (with braid etc) - So presumably (given context) some form or artillery dress tunic?

I (tentatively) think the piece in the background is a 10.5cm Feldhaubitze 98/09 (can someone confirm?)

attachicon.gifartillery.jpg

Re post #76

Chris, your cavalryman is wearing the Attila tunic of the Husaren. Luckily these units all wore different combinations of colours on their headwear (Mützen).

So looking at the photo I am going to go with a Dunkelblau top, a Red shade of capband and with White piping. Also appears to be the Prussian kokarden.

That narrows the unit down to being the Husaren-Regt. Landgraf Friedrich III von Hessen-Homburg (2.Kurhessisches) Nr.14 and from the XI Armee Korps.

Those Hussars are so easy to spot thanks to their braided tunics. The Husaren-Regiment Landgraf Friedrich II von Hessen-Homburg (2. Kurhessisches) Nr.14 is quite possible, but note that this chap has a light (white?) piping on his shoulder boards and cuffs, and so there are other possibilities.

Looks like a Hussar.

There were 21 or so Hussar regiments.

Just for the record, I am pretty sure there were only 20 - so only one off!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
trajan

How about this chap then? Not entirely sure it is military -- could be railway or.... given the collar. He appears to have just one cockard with some other badge/collar symbol.

attachicon.gif120.jpg

The 3rd Reich railway emblem was a wheel with two wings and so I guess this is the Bahnhof badge - the bahnhof meister?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
trajan

I scanned a few more overnight - both horse transport and both appear to have unit markings on them.

The first looks like a group of convalescent soldiers on a trip to the countryside - accompanied by a horse drawn medical transport.

attachicon.gif112web.jpg

attachicon.gif112detailweb.jpg

Feldlazarett 4 (Field hospital 4), XII Armee Korps (XII (1st Royal Saxon) Corps).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
trajan

Here are a few more - grouped simply because they use a vignette style of photograph and varying uniform styles

attachicon.gif122w.jpg attachicon.gif

This chap:

post-69449-0-44343100-1419968599_thumb.j

is interesting! He has a pre- or early WW1 belt buckle, and an EK ribbon - not certain of the other. Also a black Verwundetenabzeichen (wound badge), for those wounded in action or frostbite at the front, on his lower chest - this was introduced on 3 March 1918, so gives you the terminus ante quem for the photograph. He also has horizontal stripes on his collar above his NCO lace (with no button, and so an unteroffizier), and so IIRC he is ex-cavalry of some sort - sorry can't check which right now...

Note also his troddel, which has the NCO threading.

I'm going to take a break now, as it is time for dinner... Also, SS will be back up on line soon!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×