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hmsk212

Discharge - Kings Regulations Para 392

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hmsk212   
hmsk212

Hi,

I have always been perplexed by the meanings of the various clauses to Para 392 that appear on War & Victory Medal Rolls etc. I have therefore looked them up at Kew and list them below for anyone else who was in the same boat as me. I apologise if this has been put on the site before.

Cause of Discharge

(i) References on enlistment being unsatisfactory

(ii) Having been irregularly enlisted

(iii) Not being likely to become an efficient soldier

(a) Recruit rejected both by medical officer and approving officer

(B) Recruit passed by medical officer, but rejected by a recruiting

officer stationed away from the headquarters of the recruiting area, or

by approving officer

(c ) Recruit within three months of enlistment considered unfit for service

(cc) Recruits with more than three months service considered unfit for

further military service

(d) Recruit who after having undergone a course of physical training is

recommended by an examining board to be discharged, or in the case

of a mounted corps is unable to ride

(e) Soldier of local battalion abroad considered unlikely to become efficient

(f) Boy, who, on reaching 18 years of age, is considered to be physically

unfit for the ranks

(iv) Having been claimed as an apprentice

(v) Having claimed it on payment of 10/- within three months after his

attestation

(vi) Having made a mis-statement as to age on enlistment

(a) Soldier under 17 years of age at date of application for discharge

(B) Soldier between 17 and 18 years of age at date of application for

discharge

(vii) Having been claimed for wife desertion

(a) By the parish authorities

(B) By the wife

(viii) Having made false answer on attestation

(ix) Unfitted for the duties of the corps

(x) Having been convicted by the civil power of ___ or of an offence comitted

before enlistment

(xi) For misconduct

(xii) Having been sentenced to penal servitude

(xiii) Having been sentenced to be discharged with ignomony

(xiv) At his own request on payment of ___ under Article 1130 (i), Pay Warrant

(xv) Free, after ___ years service under Article 1130 (ii), Pay Warrant

(xva) Free under Article 1130 (i), Pay Warrant

(xvb) Free. To take up civil employment which cannot be held open

(xvi) No longer physically fit for service

(xviii) At his own request after 18 years service (with a view to pension under

the Pay Warrant)

(xix) For the benefit of the public service after 18 years service (with a view to

pension under the Pay Warrant)

(xx) Inefficiency after 18 years service ( with a view to a pension under the

Pay Warrant)

(xxi) The termination of his ___ period of engagement

(xxii) With less than 21 years service towards engagement, but with 21 or

more years service towards pension

(xxiii) Having claimed discharge after three months notice

(xxiv) Having reached the age for discharge

(xxv) His service being no longer required

(xxvi) At his own request after 21 (or more) years service (with a view to

pension under the Pay Warrant)

(xxvii) After 21 (or more) years qualifying service for pension, and with 5 (or

more) years service as warrant officer (with a view to pension under the

Pay Warrant)

There appears to be no clause (xvii) and I have also come across clauses not listed here (xxva), (xxviii). I would assume that these were later additions to the regulations. If anyone out there in the ether can give me any further information on the clauses mentioned I would be most grateful.

Cheers

Steve

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Chris_Baker   
Chris_Baker

Steve, that's great. I'll put a page on it on the Long, Long Trail, with appropriate credit.

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hmsk212   
hmsk212

Many thanks for that Chris. I had better leave the site now or I might be discharged under Para 392 Clause (viib)

Steve

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Sue Light   
Sue Light

Steve

Thank you very much for that - everything you've ever needed to know about para 392 but were afraid to ask! :rolleyes:

Regards - Sue

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Will O'Brien   
Will O'Brien
Many thanks for that Chris. I had better leave the site now or I might be discharged under Para 392 Clause (viib)

Steve

:lol:

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Sue Light   
Sue Light
(xxii)      With less than 21 years service towards engagement, but with 21 or  more years service towards pension

Having read this through, most of it seems quite clear, but can anyone enlighten me on the meaning of the above clause. Probably obvious to all but me :blink:

Thanks - Sue

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Greenwoodman   
Greenwoodman

I would say that this clause applies to a man on his second (or third, etc.) engagement, who has signed on for 21 years in his current engagement, who has accumulated 21 years pensionable service overall (taking into account both or all engagements), but not yet achieved 21 years in his current engagement.

One of the experts will sort it out if I've got it wrong. :D

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Charles Fair   
Charles Fair

Steve, thats brilliant many thanks, have come across many of these on the SWB rolls and have been meaning to find out what they all meant

cheers

Charles

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RWFmedals   
RWFmedals

Can anyone enlighten me on KR 392 (xvia) ?

Any help gratefully received.

Richard

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stiletto_33853   
stiletto_33853

Steve,

Thanks for taking the tme and posting this, it helps a lot.

Andy

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hmsk212   
hmsk212

Blimey

A resurrection from 15 months ago :) How time flies

Steve

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Jay Oen   
Jay Oen

Steve,

Looks like you got out of your discharge under Para 392 Clause (viib) :D:D

Cheers,

JAY

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RWFmedals   
RWFmedals

That's the problem with posting very useful reference works Steve - they will come back to haunt you :lol:

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Muerrisch   
Muerrisch
There appears to be no clause (xvii) and I have also come across clauses not listed here (xxva), (xxviii). I would assume that these were later additions to the regulations.

I think xvii. disappeared c 1912 or 1913 when amendments were promulgated in AO whereby new xvb. and xvi. IN TWO PARAGRAPHS were inserted. I can look AOs up at Cambridge Uni. when I next go if they are needed, but one would need the previous KR or QR to make complete sense. My collection has a gap between 1885 and 1912 amended to 1914. I quote from the latter below:

xxva. is a sub clause of xxv:

xxva. services no longer rqd, cannot be discharged under any other heading [!!!!!!!!] a catchall clause.

xxvb. boy

As for xxviii was not current in 1914.

The impossible takes a little longer.

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BiviBasha   
BiviBasha

Thank you hmsK212

My Grt Grandad was discharged under Kings Regs PARA 392 (XXV), Services being no longer required. From the Hampshire Regiment in 1915.

Cheers

BiviBasha

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daveburtonwilliams   
daveburtonwilliams

I've come across a couple of entries of men who were awarded the Silver War Badge. They were both discharged under KR392 (xxv) and ACI 2333/16. I know that (xxv) is "services no longer required". Can anyone help with the other reference. (I had thought - obviously incorrectly - that the SWB was only awarded to those discharged under para xiv). The names are Sgt Harry Hudson 4th R R Dns 20664 and Pte Walter Worsencroft 5th Lancers 11663

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sjdagutis   
sjdagutis

Thank you so much for the list of reasons! Very helpful. Now, I understand why my ancestor was discharged but I don't understand the rest of the abbreviations. Could anyone enlighten?

Tried to attach the file but it was too big so here is my best stab at a transcription:

Medal Index Cards, WO/372/7, Image Reference 30159 Name: Findlay, Charles
Corps: Highland Light Infantry
Regiment No.: 8311
Rank: Private
Enlistment: 18 Aug 1914
Discharge: 30 Oct 1914
Cause of Discharge: 392 XVI KR A O II 6 [or G] W S No. O Lellol, .18
Action Taken: List D/A/690

According to the birth registration of a daughter in 1918, he was in the 5th ( R ) Battalion, Highland Light Infantry at the time of her birth.

Schalene

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alanst500   
alanst500

Thank you so much for the list of reasons! Very helpful. Now, I understand why my ancestor was discharged but I don't understand the rest of the abbreviations. Could anyone enlighten?

Tried to attach the file but it was too big so here is my best stab at a transcription:

Medal Index Cards, WO/372/7, Image Reference 30159 Name: Findlay, Charles

Corps: Highland Light Infantry

Regiment No.: 8311

Rank: Private

Enlistment: 18 Aug 1914

Discharge: 30 Oct 1914

Cause of Discharge: 392 XVI KR A O II 6 [or G] W S No. O Lellol, .18

Action Taken: List D/A/690

According to the birth registration of a daughter in 1918, he was in the 5th ( R ) Battalion, Highland Light Infantry at the time of her birth.

Schalene

Please see pic 392 iiie

post-99543-0-59326900-1460214289_thumb.j

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GNH   
GNH

Thanks for this post - very useful as I was just looking at the discharge of a soldier from the Royal Lancaster Regiment in 1916.  Reason 'Para 392 XVI KR'

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Ron Clifton   
Ron Clifton

392 (xvi) is probably the commonest you will see - "no longer physically fit for service."

 

Ron

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GNH   
GNH

Thanks Ron.  Under 'Action taken' it has List H/592.  Any ideas?

Graham

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David_Underdown   
David_Underdown

The list number (like a medal roll) with details of the issue.  They are available in full on Ancestry, or in transcript form on FindMyPast.  Like medal rolls there's sometimes a bit more info than on the index card.

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GNH   
GNH

Thanks David.  I will have a look

Graham

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